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Andy style evolution

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michelle
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #30 on: August 17, 2012, 02:02 PM »
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Hi Ruthie and all,

I've mentioned a couple of times how flat Andy's team were. I swear Danny was asleep at one point. It just seemed like an off day all around. I do wonder if they knew something wasn't quite right, maybe Andy didn't seem as up for it as usual. Only they would know. I just wish my cheering Andy on and reminding him of that beautiful gold medal had helped. I must learn that talking to the TV doesn't work, and makes me seem strange lol.

I suppose I should say this on the other thread, but to be truthful I'm not sure Andy can win. Before anyone throws things at me, what I mean is he can't win in the eyes critics, and even some of his fans.

What happened yesterday would not be a concern had Andy won Toronto. If he'd pulled a win there off on the back of the Olympics we would have all been jubilant.

Had he done the same at Cincy we would have all been beside ourselves, practically giving him the USO trophy before he'd stepped foot in New York. It would, in our eyes, been something akin to the Second Coming.

However, I would estimate that it would have taken all of about five minutes for someone to worry that maybe Andy would go in to New York a bit overcooked, a bit tired, and maybe an early round disaster was possible. From jubilance and excitement, the mood would turn black in an instant, and mass hysteria would have broken out - at least with those given to mass hysteria. Personally I think it requires too much energy.

I really do think that with Lendl beside him Andy has shifted his focus to the majors, and big situations like the Olympics. Frankly, as long as he does well enough, he can go back to winning Masters when he is too old to be effective in the majors as far as I'm concerned. Don't get me wrong, I'd like him to do well in both, but with the best will in the world a player is not remembered for how many Masters they've won. They are remembered for the majors.

I personally want to see Andy take the place I feel he deserves in the history of the sport, or rather the place his talent deserves, as one of the greats, but I guess he will only do that in some eyes if he wins a major - or five. He is good enough to do that and has time. However, if the thing he has to sacrifice to do that is a few Masters tournaments, then so what?

You have said exactly what I was thinking.
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blueberryhill
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #31 on: August 17, 2012, 02:11 PM »
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It's so typical after all this he goes and plays like he did yesterday.



He's testing us, just testing us......Wink
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Ruthie
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #32 on: August 17, 2012, 02:15 PM »
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 tj @1.57pm  You've put your finger on the tendency on MW and I guess elsewhere to lurch from euphoria to despair.   I know this partly reflects the roller coaster nature of Andy's progression.  But I've said it before that some people do seem to build him up only to pull him down the minute he doesn't quite meet their exacting expectations. 
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teejay1
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #33 on: August 17, 2012, 05:50 PM »
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tj @1.57pm  You've put your finger on the tendency on MW and I guess elsewhere to lurch from euphoria to despair.   I know this partly reflects the roller coaster nature of Andy's progression.  But I've said it before that some people do seem to build him up only to pull him down the minute he doesn't quite meet their exacting expectations. 

Hi Ruthie and all,

Don't get me wrong, I do think it is understandable. I've seen it before about other people and other subjects. I'm sure people wouldn't do so much worrying if they didn't care. In a way it is Andy's fault, bless him, for making us all feel so engaged with him and his career. Every win, every loss, the good days, the bad days, are all taken so personally. I openly admit I'm as bad as anyone. After the Wimbledon final I probably moped for longer than Andy, and he'd played the thing.

I'm equally understanding of all the ifs and buts about points etc. The trouble is that a lot of the discussion is all ifs and buts. Andy could, in theory, have a horrible USO. I doubt it, but he could. Equally, he could have a fabulous USO, and then go on to defend all those points in the latter part of the year, in which case it will be problems solved, and everything in the garden will be rosy.

I just think it is all a matter of perspective, and not worrying about things we can't control and can't predict. It is also a matter of not getting over carried away with success, although celebrating is fun and the right thing to do, just to pull the rug out from under the man just on the basis of a bad day.

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janscribe
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #34 on: August 17, 2012, 06:42 PM »
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^ Totally agreed.  He can't go back from these performances now.  I was the biggest sceptic while watching his passive play - now I think he believes in himself and I think that is monumental.
Ely it's great to hear you say that, even after his loss to Chardy yesterday and Philip your article is excellent, it touches the important 'happenings' in Andy's game over the last few weeks. Many thanks.
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Philip
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #35 on: August 17, 2012, 09:09 PM »
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Thanks everyone for your comments.  I had the urge to start this thread as I felt Andy has worked hard and made steady progress with Lendl throughout this year.  It gives me great joy to watch the Olympic SF and Final over and over and see the massive improvements Andy has made since Jan. The Olympics has clearly demonstrated to himself that not only can he compete on an equal footing with the best, but to have surpassed them when he is uninhibited and playing to his true potential.  What is exciting is that Andy was serving nowhere near his best at the SF and Final and his FH can become even stronger with more practice.  

The way he unleashed his FH at Max Mynia had the beast running for cover in the first set of the MD lol. They were scared of him as his presence and dominance at the net was palpable.

I think with a week practice with Lendl in the coming days, we are going to be in for a treat at the USO. The future is bright. The future is Andy.
[ Last edit by Philip August 19, 2012, 07:36 AM ] IP Logged
Ruthie
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #36 on: August 18, 2012, 09:59 PM »
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That's a v good point Philip that Andy won the Olympics when his serving was below par.  And we often say his successes depend on his serving well.  Let's just hope he sorts out the serve before NY so as to make life easier for himself.
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blueberryhill
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #37 on: August 19, 2012, 07:33 AM »
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@ Philip. Loving"The future is bright. The future is Andy." clap
Come on Andole yay
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flowerpower
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #38 on: August 24, 2012, 10:37 AM »
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Not only Andy has changed, also Judy. At the OS she applauds (right way of spelling ?)  standing lots of times in stead of showing her fist with an aggessive  expression. Think the way they support  it's part of the way they (his team) want to reach more people on a positive way. For me it looks a bit unnatural....but I think it's wise. For some reason Judy gets very much attention of the camera when Andy plays...
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TheMadHatter
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #39 on: August 26, 2012, 12:40 PM »
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Not only Andy has changed, also Judy. At the OS she applauds (right way of spelling ?)  standing lots of times in stead of showing her fist with an aggessive  expression. Think the way they support  it's part of the way they (his team) want to reach more people on a positive way. For me it looks a bit unnatural....but I think it's wise. For some reason Judy gets very much attention of the camera when Andy plays...
She gets so much stick and abuse. When asked why (well, I tend to go for the sarcastic, "ye how dare she support her son, awful woman") they respond that the reason they hate her is because she's always being shown. Ye, I mean, that's clearly her fault. Rolling Eyes

It's so ridiculous. Why do so many people need someone or something to hate? Logic seems to go out the window.
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #40 on: August 26, 2012, 04:34 PM »
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What really impressed me at the Olympics was the sheer number of break points Andy defended - a whole new mentally tough attitude was apparent - "you will not win this break point".  Really great to watch.

What happened in the last tournament was just a bad day of the office, I hope.  I'm parking it away along with the Queen's first round defeat, which didnlt prove to be any indicator of Andy's performance at Wimby, did it?
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teejay1
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #41 on: August 26, 2012, 10:30 PM »
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Hi Mickeypops and All,

I think you're absolutely right. Just looking at the semi and final alone, Andy faced 12 break points against him, and each time he handled the situation beautifully, often serving well, producing aces, just when he needed it most. It was incredibly gritty.

The other thing was that I watched that last set of the Olympic final again yesterday. I managed to notice somthing I hadn't seen before. Early in the set Andy had a chance to break Federer. Federer was 15-40 down and serving to stay in the game. Yesterday I lip-read Andy at that point just as Federer was about to serve. "Come on, first one", Andy said, and though you can't hear it, it is clear. The meaning is obvious. Take the first break point. It showed such a positive attitude. The point to add is that Andy actually didn't win that game, but he didn't get frustrated, as he might have done in the past. He just got on with it, holding his own service game before going on to break Federer.

It's that sort of thing that tells me that Andy really has turned a corner, that what he did at the Olympics is not a fluke, and he didn't win that gold because Federer was tired. Andy won because he has changed in a number of fundamental ways, some in his game, but a lot in between his ears.  Andy, to my mind, now looks like the winner he is destined to be. Whether that comes at this USO, the AO or wherever, I'm sure it is going to happen very soon. Then, once he has added his first major to his Olympic Gold, just you watch him go. I'd bet big money on it.

I'm convinced Cincy was just one of those things. Maybe Andy could have dug a bit deeper and saved the Chardy match, but given how much he has played, not to mention all the other stuff, lack of sleep etc, and the fact that the USO was looming, what was the point? There would have been no point in winning Cincy and wearing himself out in the process, if he had then gone to Flushing Meadows in no fit state to put himself in the position to win.

Queen's was irrelevant to Wimbledon for Andy. I'm sure Cincy will turn out irrelevant to the USO.
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Ruthie
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #42 on: August 27, 2012, 09:58 AM »
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Hi Mickeypops and All,

I think you're absolutely right. Just looking at the semi and final alone, Andy faced 12 break points against him, and each time he handled the situation beautifully, often serving well, producing aces, just when he needed it most. It was incredibly gritty.

The other thing was that I watched that last set of the Olympic final again yesterday. I managed to notice somthing I hadn't seen before. Early in the set Andy had a chance to break Federer. Federer was 15-40 down and serving to stay in the game. Yesterday I lip-read Andy at that point just as Federer was about to serve. "Come on, first one", Andy said, and though you can't hear it, it is clear. The meaning is obvious. Take the first break point. It showed such a positive attitude. The point to add is that Andy actually didn't win that game, but he didn't get frustrated, as he might have done in the past. He just got on with it, holding his own service game before going on to break Federer.

 
 

Interesting tj.  And as well as saving so many BPs (and in some earlier matches too including at Wimbledon) I think his conversion rate of BPs must have improved?  It's something he's been criticised for before but as he plays more attacking confident tennis he does seem to be converting more.
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TheMadHatter
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #43 on: August 27, 2012, 10:13 AM »
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Not sure about the break point conversion rate for Wimbledon and the Olympics (I'm sure it is higher) but his attitude to break points certainly improved. Rather than sit back and get passive having hit a couple of winners to win the break points, he stepped it up and looked to attack. The match point against Tsonga is a great example.
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teejay1
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Re: Andy style evolution « Reply #44 on: August 27, 2012, 12:35 PM »
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Interesting tj.  And as well as saving so many BPs (and in some earlier matches too including at Wimbledon) I think his conversion rate of BPs must have improved?  It's something he's been criticised for before but as he plays more attacking confident tennis he does seem to be converting more.

I haven't looked at the figures to prove it, but I think his BP conversion rate must have improved. If I remember rightly he seemed to be having difficulty converting break points earlier in the year, I think I remember it being remarked upon, so I'm sure it has improved.

To my mind it is all about the same thing, looking to attack, looking for chances, seeking to be on the front foot, being proactive, rather than waiting for the opponent to make an error before pouncing.
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