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Musings on 2014 so far

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Iluvandy
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #15 on: August 09, 2014, 02:21 PM »
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While I didn't say anything last night remotely negative, remember this.

I'm all in for Andy, but I'm a massive pessimist, and have been for all my life. I refuse to change my DNA for a small group of people on this site. So if I am negative, let me be negative. Just the same for everyone else.

Thank you Smile

If you did, I lost it in the welter of stupid, insulting posts from the usual suspects.     I don't think anyone thought of asking you to change your DNA even if that were possible.    But there are annoying people on this site who seem to think Andy should change his and become a Fed or a Nadal or a Djokovic - perish the thought on all three.
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Milly87
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #16 on: August 09, 2014, 02:39 PM »
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Back on the horse, not sulking, crying or moaning, but back at it because he believes he can and should do better. Go on lad!


RT @onthegotennis: Qualifying today on 8 courts, while 8 other courts have main draw players — such as Murray, Sharapova and Wawrinka — practicing #cincytennis
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janscribe
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #17 on: August 09, 2014, 05:20 PM »
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An interesting and non-inflammatory thread and thank you Milly. Personally I think that Lendl's departure just as he was getting back to full health after his surgery was a big downer for Andy, he wouldn't admit it but I do wish he and Ivan had been able to work out a 'deal' for the future.
No wonder he felt enough anger to smash his racquet to smithereens, he played so well in his last match, so positively and, normally, Tsonga has been a successful target for him. He seems beset by coming up against good players who come into top form, are full of the confidence which wins matches, and despite his immense talent he cannot overcome their spurt of excellence and come out on the winning side. With all the skills he has, the super shots and technical now-how, at the moment he can't get it all to work for him.

I don't know any more than anyone else what will happen; I'm not being negative but there are problems to iron out before he can regain winning ways, I suspect a few psychology problems may be the culprit. I'll watch him til he retires - not only is he a sensational tennis player but I believe from all I've read that he is also a thoroughly decent, sensitive and moral human being. His talent indicates this is probably a blip, a bad year brought about by surgery. What we are seeing is a man going through a crisis, we've all had them, but we don't have to go through them in public with the world watching. No doubt I will be labelled as 'burying my head in the sand', I don't like his losses any more than anyone else but I haven't given up hoping that sometime soon he will be back on track.             
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Milly87
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #18 on: August 09, 2014, 06:36 PM »
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An interesting and non-inflammatory thread and thank you Milly. Personally I think that Lendl's departure just as he was getting back to full health after his surgery was a big downer for Andy, he wouldn't admit it but I do wish he and Ivan had been able to work out a 'deal' for the future.
No wonder he felt enough anger to smash his racquet to smithereens, he played so well in his last match, so positively and, normally, Tsonga has been a successful target for him. He seems beset by coming up against good players who come into top form, are full of the confidence which wins matches, and despite his immense talent he cannot overcome their spurt of excellence and come out on the winning side. With all the skills he has, the super shots and technical now-how, at the moment he can't get it all to work for him.

I don't know any more than anyone else what will happen; I'm not being negative but there are problems to iron out before he can regain winning ways, I suspect a few psychology problems may be the culprit. I'll watch him til he retires - not only is he a sensational tennis player but I believe from all I've read that he is also a thoroughly decent, sensitive and moral human being. His talent indicates this is probably a blip, a bad year brought about by surgery. What we are seeing is a man going through a crisis, we've all had them, but we don't have to go through them in public with the world watching. No doubt I will be labelled as 'burying my head in the sand', I don't like his losses any more than anyone else but I haven't given up hoping that sometime soon he will be back on track.             


Glad you think so, Janscribe, that's exactly what I was aiming for. Agree with rest of your post too.
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The Gnome
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #19 on: August 09, 2014, 09:01 PM »
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I read something online the other day but can't for the life of me find it again. Anyway the gist of it was that some Psychotherapist thinks that those 15 minutes in the last game of the Wimbleodn final took it's toll on him mentally and that Andy 'could' be still suffering it's lingering after effetcs. In other words, it took so much out of him mentally, whenever he feels similar pressure, his once usually strong mentality causes him undue stress and this is where the fear and pressure comes from. Understandable as i expect he really doesn't want to go through that kind of mental anguish again.

With regards to Jo-Willy and others managing to beat him this year, i personally feel it's down to how vulnerable Murray is right now. Players sense it and now bank on his lapses in concentration, either that or they just don't feel as intimated by him as they once used too. Dimitrov even went so far as to mention it in his post match interview at Wimbledon.
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Aileen
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #20 on: August 10, 2014, 05:12 AM »
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I read something online the other day but can't for the life of me find it again. Anyway the gist of it was that some Psychotherapist thinks that those 15 minutes in the last game of the Wimbleodn final took it's toll on him mentally and that Andy 'could' be still suffering it's lingering after effetcs. In other words, it took so much out of him mentally, whenever he feels similar pressure, his once usually strong mentality causes him undue stress and this is where the fear and pressure comes from. Understandable as i expect he really doesn't want to go through that kind of mental anguish again.
Like some form of post-traumatic stress disorder?  If nothing else it bears out my thinking, which I've only ever told somebody by PM because I knew I'd be howled down if I said it on that match thread, and that is that the reason for Andy's strange meltdown against Dimitrov was due to the fact that he simply lost his nerve.  I'm not convinced that anything upset him 45 minutes before the match, or at least not anything major, but in a state of panic (as I know only too well) your head can get full of all sorts of thoughts, and so I believe that this was just one of those that he shouted at his team - although did he actually say it?  As far as I know we only have the word of one journalist, and even he managed to report it wrongly first time around by saying it was five minutes before the match, so therefore its veracity has to be questioned.  Also his bizarre act of going off the court and straight to his car without changing out of his kit, and leaving a very upset Kim behind, probably because she was well aware of the situation, is also typical of panicky behaviour.  It's hardly surprising really that he went to ground for two weeks, not even posting his thoughts on the World Cup on Twitter, which was a bit uncharacteristic, before heading off to Miami for training.

If anybody watched Sir Chris Hoy's excellent documentary "How to win Gold", they'll perhaps remember Sir Chris saying that the nearer he came to winning a championship the more nervous he got because he was so desperate to win, all of which is perfectly understandable, only here Andy was under enormous expectation to defend his Wimbledon title.  In fact he'd merely exchanged one kind of pressure for another, and I recall Pete Sampras saying in an article prior to Wimbledon that defending a Slam title for the first time was difficult because it required a completely different mind-set, so did Andy have that?  I doubt it, but had Lendl still been around I'm sure he might have been of considerable help, although whether or not it would have succeeded in overcoming the psychological barrier we'll never know.  Andy played well for four rounds but we've no idea how nervous he was feeling, only that he said later than he'd felt 'very nervous' before the Dimitrov match.  So far so good though, but I believe that the QF match, against a player who was a tough opponent but still one he should have beaten, was just the last straw.  It also begs the question - did the same thing happen in last year's USO?  Was his back really the cause of his poor performance, again in the QF despite playing well for four rounds there too?

Sir Chris got over his problem by seeking help from a psychiatrist who taught him a simple way of compartmentalising his thoughts, which included how to shut out the extraneous ones that go part and parcel with anxiety, so I can't help feeling that Andy would benefit from seeking expert help himself.  OK, so we've been down this road before, but at least since then he did see a psychologist recommended by Lendl and said he found it helpful, so instead of shunning psychologists as he has done in the past, perhaps he would be amenable to consulting one now - if he hasn't already done so - the problem being that no psychologist in the world can wave a magic wand, and hey presto! everything's fine.  I've seen psychologists, and believe me it can take several consultations and a lot of putting things into practice before getting on top of the issue.

[ Last edit by Aileen August 10, 2014, 06:04 AM ] IP Logged
tamila
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #21 on: August 10, 2014, 06:56 AM »
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@ Gnome and Aileen.

This is something that someone suggested a while ago.  I cannot remember who.  He has had so much pressure all his pro life and then it sort of lifted but returned again this year in a different form.  My aunt had kept on about him doing it again this year.  None of the other top ten have had this pressure on them as they do not have a Slam in their own country and also they do not have the 'British' press or public o deal with.  The old players such as Natase etc. all say the  British are the worst in the world for misquoting and turning around at the first stumble of a sportsman.  Perhaps they think they should win everything and that it is okay to misquote all the time.
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Connor
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #22 on: August 10, 2014, 07:06 AM »
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I don't think anyone fears Andy anymore, which means more players such as Tsonga or Kyrgios will come out firing, because they know if they play their best, they have a better chance of winning than against anyone else, because that fear factor won't come into play as it so often does.
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wimbledonwestie
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #23 on: August 10, 2014, 06:57 PM »
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I read something online the other day but can't for the life of me find it again. Anyway the gist of it was that some Psychotherapist thinks that those 15 minutes in the last game of the Wimbleodn final took it's toll on him mentally and that Andy 'could' be still suffering it's lingering after effetcs. In other words, it took so much out of him mentally, whenever he feels similar pressure, his once usually strong mentality causes him undue stress and this is where the fear and pressure comes from. Understandable as i expect he really doesn't want to go through that kind of mental anguish again.


That's definitely the feeling I got from his comments about it in the documentary.
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MT
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #24 on: August 10, 2014, 07:02 PM »
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Back on the horse, not sulking, crying or moaning, but back at it because he believes he can and should do better. Go on lad!


RT @onthegotennis: Qualifying today on 8 courts, while 8 other courts have main draw players — such as Murray, Sharapova and Wawrinka — practicing #cincytennis
If you did, I lost it in the welter of stupid, insulting posts from the usual suspects.     I don't think anyone thought of asking you to change your DNA even if that were possible.    But there are annoying people on this site who seem to think Andy should change his and become a Fed or a Nadal or a Djokovic - perish the thought on all three.
Go out in in the second round you mean.   Djokowic is not written off when he loses one match.
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Milly87
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #25 on: August 16, 2014, 02:26 AM »
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Poor love, needs to get his confidence back and keep, keep believing. RT @SI_Tennis: Andy Murray: “I blew it.” Frustrated by his inconsistency. #cincytennis


Starting to think smaller tournaments to get his belief back are the way to go.
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Aileen
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #26 on: August 16, 2014, 04:03 AM »
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@ Gnome and Aileen.

This is something that someone suggested a while ago.  I cannot remember who.  He has had so much pressure all his pro life and then it sort of lifted but returned again this year in a different form.  My aunt had kept on about him doing it again this year.  None of the other top ten have had this pressure on them as they do not have a Slam in their own country and also they do not have the 'British' press or public o deal with.  The old players such as Natase etc. all say the  British are the worst in the world for misquoting and turning around at the first stumble of a sportsman.  Perhaps they think they should win everything and that it is okay to misquote all the time.
I agree but still think losing Lendl as his coach had a huge impact on him.  I must admit that when that happened any optimism I had about him defending his Wimbledon was seriously diminished.


Poor love, needs to get his confidence back and keep, keep believing. RT @SI_Tennis: Andy Murray: “I blew it.” Frustrated by his inconsistency. #cincytennis


Starting to think smaller tournaments to get his belief back are the way to go.
Not many left this year unfortunately.  I still maintain though that he could benefit from seeing a sports psychologist.
[ Last edit by Aileen August 16, 2014, 04:08 AM ] IP Logged
tamila
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #27 on: August 16, 2014, 05:47 AM »
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@aileen.  Are we sure he isn't?  I am wondering if Amelie is the right person but Lendl did say it takes a while for a new coach to help and that sometimes the player drops back a bit.  Too much has happened this year to our Andy.  I am sure none of us would cope any better.
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blueberryhill
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #28 on: August 16, 2014, 06:47 AM »
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My thoughts? Damn Lendl, couldn't he have waited a year?
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althusser
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Re: Musings on 2014 so far « Reply #29 on: August 16, 2014, 07:48 AM »
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I think it is rather early for judging on Amelie as coach....

But is there a case for some other changes in 'team Murray'? Currently he does not look prepared for big matches, he has been left in the starting blocks against Nadal, dimitrov and now fed. In each match his opponents look totally prepared with a plan to beat him. On Andys side it has been hard to discern a plan, the matches are just happening to him

should he think about bigger change in those around him?

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