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Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis

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blueberryhill
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #405 on: August 09, 2013, 07:15 AM »
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@Masaka
I sometimes wonder why some people support Andy at all. The anger, when he loses, seems totally irrational and OTT. Rolling Eyes
Of course, we want him to win everything and are disappointed when he loses, but  so what? Life and tennis go on.
In best of 3 anything can happen and the depth and talent in tennis is pretty amazing and should not be underestimated.
Best thing to do on the net is to develop a thick skin.....yes  even or especially on here ...... Whistle
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Ruthie
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #406 on: August 09, 2013, 07:32 AM »
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tj @10.48pm.  Agree with much of what you say but Andy himself concedes that at present he may not have the consistency outside slams to become no 1 in the current field.   And as Andy knows himself better than we do [however expert some of us like to think we are on the subject] perhaps it was a warning to his fans not to expect the number 1 slot.  If Andy is happy never to make number 1, then that's ok with me.   I'm proud he has won two slams and an olympic medal and hope he achieves his ambition of winning more slams.  yay
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tamila
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #407 on: August 09, 2013, 07:39 AM »
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A month ago today you could come on this forum n the positivity was everywhere.  He lost a tennis match, Andy is not a robotic player, he is a tormented genius - human frailities as well.  He achieved the greatest tennis feat only a month ago in truly spectacular style I bet Berdych n Ferrer would trade for that. 

The highs are high and somehow the lows now are lesser than they used to be, some of the comments on here tonight from the usual suspects are so insane their funny.  The USO is obviously his priority do you not remember the days of winning his masters titles just before a GS then crashing out.  Those days are gone now he plans to peak at the slams, I really think some of you need to learn to trust a player and his coach that have delivered 2 Grand Slams and a Gold Olympic medal!!



Great post! My thoughts exactly.
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tamila
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #408 on: August 09, 2013, 07:45 AM »
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TJ, 10.48 and Masaka 9.50.  I do not need to post as yopu express my feelings exactly.
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Sabine
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #409 on: August 09, 2013, 07:52 AM »
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Omg, Andy and Fleming won against Paes and Stepanek in straight sets!!
So happy for them even though I'm a big fan of Leander. yay

Okie, next up is Qureshi and Rojer. Hope they telecast the match.
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michelle
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #410 on: August 09, 2013, 08:00 AM »
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@Masaka
I sometimes wonder why some people support Andy at all. The anger, when he loses, seems totally irrational and OTT. Rolling Eyes
Of course, we want him to win everything and are disappointed when he loses, but  so what? Life and tennis go on.
In best of 3 anything can happen and the depth and talent in tennis is pretty amazing and should not be underestimated.
Best thing to do on the net is to develop a thick skin.....yes  even or especially on here ...... Whistle
Totally agree with you. He was not the only player yesterday to lose to lower ranked players, it happens as we all know, we've only got to look at who Gulbis has beaten in the past, Fed,Rafa etc. Andy was not match fit and this will come. He is still in the doubles and that will give him some more match practice before Cincy. There I feel we will see a match fit Andy. hug hug
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Masaka
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #411 on: August 09, 2013, 08:50 AM »
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Gotta love these people dictating how we should react when Murray puts in a poor performance.

You react your way, we'll react our own way. I've had about enough of people attempting to take the high ground simply because they don't feel the need to vent after a performance like today's.

It's not about dictating to people about how they react when he loses. As far as I am concerned it's about me simply not understanding how people can say they support a particular sportsman/woman, yet write such savage/nasty and unpleasant things if he ever loses. I imagine all of us are disappointed when he loses, but the sane, rational people don't take out their disappointment by mauling him.  They recognise that in sport nobody wins all if the time, it would be meaningless if they did. They also recognise that these people are human, and that brings with it fallibility. I suspect many of us were drawn to Murray because of his uniqueness, and those facets of his personality that make him such an interesting character. To then complain because he is not capable of performing robotically seems rather contrary to me.

It's not about taking the high ground. The day I stop finding some of the character assassinations that Murray gets whenever he dares lose, offensive and objectionable is the day I stop being me. If being me, is somebody who accepts that losing is part of life, and doesn't feel the need to spew vitriol and bile  just because Andy Murray loses a tennis match - well I can live with that.

Being disappointed because Murray loses a tennis match is quite one thing, crucifying him on a public forum for it is quite another. If that makes me a "kitten cuddling, fluffy bunnies sort of middle aged woman", then I am guilty as charged.
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Ruthie
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #412 on: August 09, 2013, 09:17 AM »
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Masaka @ 8.50am   clap clap clap
I would just add: how people react in the privacy of their own home is their business; how they react on a public forum is ours.  No one is asking for 'fawning' (as gangsta so nicely put it) sycophancy;  of course people can express their disappointment when Andy doesn't play as well as he is capable of playing.  But savage and vicious comments such as those that have been posted are unacceptable in my view.   But still they reflect worse on those who write them than on Andy himself so I guess I shouldn't care, expect that they give ammunition to those who try to bring Andy down. 
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Clydey
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #413 on: August 09, 2013, 09:29 AM »
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Haha i stay clear of match threads for that very reason, i could care less, as far as i'm concerned if Andy wants to be somewhere else that's up to him, a lot of people are acutely aware that he is not going to play perfect every match and win every competition he enters, no tennis player on earth can do that, if ever there was someone who needs to take the advice of their own avatar, it's you.

No one expects him to play perfect tennis in every match. What we do expect is for him to actually try, at a minimum.

Also, my avatar is supposed to be ironic. Way to miss the point.
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Clydey
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #414 on: August 09, 2013, 09:36 AM »
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It's not about dictating to people about how they react when he loses. As far as I am concerned it's about me simply not understanding how people can say they support a particular sportsman/woman, yet write such savage/nasty and unpleasant things if he ever loses. I imagine all of us are disappointed when he loses, but the sane, rational people don't take out their disappointment by mauling him.  They recognise that in sport nobody wins all if the time, it would be meaningless if they did. They also recognise that these people are human, and that brings with it fallibility. I suspect many of us were drawn to Murray because of his uniqueness, and those facets of his personality that make him such an interesting character. To then complain because he is not capable of performing robotically seems rather contrary to me.

It's not about taking the high ground. The day I stop finding some of the character assassinations that Murray gets whenever he dares lose, offensive and objectionable is the day I stop being me. If being me, is somebody who accepts that losing is part of life, and doesn't feel the need to spew vitriol and bile  just because Andy Murray loses a tennis match - well I can live with that.

Being disappointed because Murray loses a tennis match is quite one thing, crucifying him on a public forum for it is quite another. If that makes me a "kitten cuddling, fluffy bunnies sort of middle aged woman", then I am guilty as charged.

It isn't about winning or losing. It's about trying. If he loses while actually putting in effort, I'm fine with that. If he looks like he would rather be elsewhere, why does he bother turning up? I can't tolerate that.

Why do you think some people get so angry when he puts in the kind of performance he put in yesterday? Could it possibly be because we are invested in his career and want him to maximise his potential?

As much as you don't understand my reaction to his subpar performances, I am equally puzzled by the indifference of people like you.

You need to recognise that not everyone is the same. Just because you react a particular way to a performance like yesterday's, it does not mean that everyone should be similarly indifferent.

It is completely rational for people who are invested in his career to be angry when he phones in a performance and wastes everyone's time, including his own.
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Clydey
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #415 on: August 09, 2013, 09:40 AM »
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Masaka @ 8.50am   clap clap clap
I would just add: how people react in the privacy of their own home is their business; how they react on a public forum is ours.  No one is asking for 'fawning' (as gangsta so nicely put it) sycophancy;  of course people can express their disappointment when Andy doesn't play as well as he is capable of playing.  But savage and vicious comments such as those that have been posted are unacceptable in my view.   But still they reflect worse on those who write them than on Andy himself so I guess I shouldn't care, expect that they give ammunition to those who try to bring Andy down. 

So your feelings trump the feelings of others? People should censor their emotions because, what, you find them off-putting?

You're right, this is a public forum. That means people get to express their views so long as they don't break the forum's rules. It doesn't mean we have to sugarcoat our opinions in order to avoid offending overly sensitive people.
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teejay1
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #416 on: August 09, 2013, 09:57 AM »
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Teejay1 - as ever the voice of sanity.

I don't know about sanity. More the voice of sick to the back teeth of seeing Andy's supporters tearing their hair out after every little loss. I bet Delpo's fans aren't doing that this morning, or Berdych's for that matter. I bet Nadal's fans weren't going to pieces when he was fighting with Janowicz yesterday too.

As much as I understand the disappointment, I just think it's a matter of perspective. After a month of not playing, with all that has happened over the last month, maybe there was bound to be a reaction. It's better it happened now than in the third round of the USO.

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teejay1
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #417 on: August 09, 2013, 10:00 AM »
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tj @10.48pm.  Agree with much of what you say but Andy himself concedes that at present he may not have the consistency outside slams to become no 1 in the current field.   And as Andy knows himself better than we do [however expert some of us like to think we are on the subject] perhaps it was a warning to his fans not to expect the number 1 slot.  If Andy is happy never to make number 1, then that's ok with me.   I'm proud he has won two slams and an olympic medal and hope he achieves his ambition of winning more slams.  yay

I just think the key part though Ruthie, is at the moment. I think that level of consistency will come. It might not on the clay of course, but then plenty have got to no.1 without doing well on the clay.

I'm just not prepared to write his chances of reaching no.1 off on the basis of one below par day, especially when he's lost hardly more than a handful of matches all year.
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teejay1
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #418 on: August 09, 2013, 10:07 AM »
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It would be worse. He cannot think that doesn't need to focus in this kind of tournament. Not if you are n. 2, even less if you want to become n. 1.
Fed, Nadal and Nole never show this stupid attitude on the courtin a master 1000!

Oh I do love trolls! Fed has won one tournament all year. Nadal went out in the first round of that little grass court tournament that Murray won this year, and I don't mean Queen's. Did I dream Djokovic losing to Dimitrov in Madrid?

Try posting again when you can say something that makes sense.
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Masaka
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Re: Rogers Cup R3: Murray vs Gulbis « Reply #419 on: August 09, 2013, 10:17 AM »
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It isn't about winning or losing. It's about trying. If he loses while actually putting in effort, I'm fine with that. If he looks like he would rather be elsewhere, why does he bother turning up? I can't tolerate that.


1) Perhaps because the rules of the tour are that he is obliged to turn up, and unlike Nadal he attempts to respect the rules.

Why do you think some people get so angry when he puts in the kind of performance he put in yesterday? Could it possibly be because we are invested in his career and want him to maximise his potential?

2) Given his background and his recent performances at critical times, (Final set at the USO last year, set 3 in the Verdasco match at Wimbledon, final game of the Wimbledon final this year).", I find it difficult to understand how you can think he isn't maximising his potential.

As much as you don't understand my reaction to his subpar performances, I am equally puzzled by the indifference of people like you.

3) I don't think any of us are indifferent to his "subpar performance". It is possibly that some of us are mature enough to recognise that perhaps that was the best performance he was capable of on that particular day, at that particular time, against that particular opponent, in those particular conditions. Some of us can also acknowledge that there might be a wider picture, that we are not privy to, and hence any number of reasons why he wasn't able to deliver the goods in a particular situation. We also recognise that there are many situations where he manages to raise his game at the crucial moment. The Miami masters final against Ferrer this year being a case in point.

You need to recognise that not everyone is the same. Just because you react a particular way to a performance like yesterday's, it does not mean that everyone should be similarly indifferent.

4) It's not about dictating to people how they should react in any given situation.  It is about wanting and expecting people to at least give Andy Murray the basic respect any fellow human being who has achieved so much against such great odds warrants.  He often doesn't get that respect on here from some people. He has lost a tennis match, not suddenly taken up axe murdering by way of a little light relief. In my opinion many people's reactions when he loses are so way over the top as to be puzzling.

It is completely rational for people who are invested in his career to be angry when he phones in a performance and wastes everyone's time, including his own.


5) Sorry I completely disagree with you - some people's reactions when he loses are not rational. In most cases they are so over the top as to be completely irrational. If people have so much emotional investment in whether Mr Murray wins or loses a tennis match. I think they need to look within themselves at their own issues, rather than focussing so much on Mr Murray's purported issues. Non of us know whether his attendance at this tournament is/was wasting his time. It might well be part of a wider picture that we are not privy to.

My intention is not to fall out with people and I have tried to respond to your points in a calm manner, and explain my point of view. I find it upsetting when somebody who I have a great deal of respect for, for the way he has conquered so many demons, is given such a hard time by many of his so called fans because of the crime of losing a tennis match. I am not indifferent to him losing. I simply recognise that it is inevitably going to happen sometimes, and can't understand why he is given such a hard time for being a mere mortal. In the end I think that the two differing factions are going to need to agree to disagree here.
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