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Addiction and depression

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Mark
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Addiction and depression « Reply #30 on: February 15, 2012, 11:46 PM »
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Emma, I'm not seeing anything new of substance coming from our argument so we're probably just going to go in circles.

I'll just conclude my views which I believe remain valid.

Addiction is not black and white, which I feel you are guilty of suggesting. There are many different scenarios, some of which you certainly cannot call "pretentious" or fully blame the victim. And these scenarios are not exceptions to any rule because they are not unusual, they are common. 

Many of these scenarios are where, for example, the victim is vulnerable to manipulation based on their environment and current mental health.

So, I think it's completely wrong to just assume Whitney deserves what she got. Becoming a celebrity can bring on loneliness that is a league above what an ordinary person will typically experience. And when you have that, along with the wrong environment and it happening to a person who is inherently vulnerable, you have a recipe for disaster. 
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Emma Jean
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Addiction and depression « Reply #31 on: February 16, 2012, 12:34 AM »
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I was extremely depressed for two years after my youngest brother suddenly passed away. A few years before that my mum suddenly passed away who was only in her early 40s. While I was able to cope with my mum's dead, my brother's death threw me completely off. If I say I was extremely close to him, it would be an understatement. Anyway, I think it's in the manner he passed away that shocked me the most. I had to spend 1 month with him in the ER. I'd see people in deep coma coming in at night and then going out dead the next morning. This would be the norm everyday. All sorts of cases and deaths everyday and night. I don't think I was mentally prepared for it at all as it came all too sudden. It especially shocks you to the very core when you realize your brother might just be the next one and you have to live with this constant fear day after day and night after night.

Anyway, after my brother’s death I moved to US to recover from all this but I hit rock bottom instead. Suddenly I found myself in the middle of nowhere. No family, no friends, no nothing. Just a bunch of strangers. I was too shy to actually confide in anyone so I'd stay quiet most of the time. I had absolutely no desire to live. None.  Everyday was a drag. I'd just go to different graveyards and spend all my time there during the day. I weighed only 92 pounds at one point. I was a student but I had to drop out because I was in no shape to actually continue both physically and mentally. And I wouldn't seek any therapy because there was no one to force me and I wasn't really looking forward to get better. I went through a lot of soul searching around that time and I'd spend almost all my time in the library. I was just looking for some answers before I thought I'd go away too. Anyway, it took me 5 long years to finally recover from it, and  it was the hardest thing I ever had to do. I still get nightmares and wake up in the middle of the time.  

I did move around a lot since then so obviously when you move around so much, you lose friends and family and it's not easy to make friends this way. In the process you become more and more lonely. I am without my family for a long time now. I did have boyfriends from time to time but for some reason, I wasn't very keen on making a family with them. Probably I didn't think they were the ones or maybe I wasn't ready yet. I thought I needed to sort my life out first.

Anyway, just wanted to tell you that I do have first hand experience otherwise I wouldn't have talked about it at all. I recovered and I recovered completely on my own without any help from anyone. I thought about many things in my down time and they sort of opened my eyes. Eckhart Tolle, one of my favourite writers, was clinically depressed for a number of years. He was also a very lonely person but he got out of it completely on his own. I like that about him because I can relate to his condition. Some fights I feel are worth fighting for and it’s such a different life afterwards. Suddenly life stands in front o you with an entirely different meaning.

If I were in Whitney’s position, I’d probably put my daughter’s interest first before I completely destroy myself. I, at least, owe that much to her since I was responsible for bringing her into this world. Life is just too precious for me especially others. It's true we mostly live in grey areas and things aren't as black and white but I never said that it was. You concluded it on your own. Drugs are only an option and that's all there's to it.  
[ Last edit by Emma Jean February 16, 2012, 12:39 AM ] IP Logged
Mark
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Addiction and depression « Reply #32 on: February 16, 2012, 12:42 AM »
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You've obviously had it tough and I'm sorry that you went through that.

I wonder what strength would be required to turn down drugs that are essentially being offered to you direct and FREE whilst suffering like that. Because that's what it's like being a celebrity around the wrong people.  You're probably a strong woman, unfortunately there are many that are not.
[ Last edit by Mark February 16, 2012, 12:47 AM ] IP Logged
Clydey
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Addiction and depression « Reply #33 on: February 16, 2012, 12:43 AM »
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I was extremely depressed for two years after my youngest brother suddenly passed away. A few years before that my mum suddenly passed away who was only in her early 40s. While I was able to cope with my mum's dead, my brother's death threw me completely off. If I say I was extremely close to him, it would be an understatement. Anyway, I think it's in the manner he passed away that shocked me the most. I had to spend 1 month with him in the ER. I'd see people in deep coma coming in at night and then going out dead the next morning. This would be the norm everyday. All sorts of cases and deaths everyday and night. I don't think I was mentally prepared for it at all as it came all too sudden. It especially shocks you to the very core when you realize your brother might just be the next one and you have to live with this constant fear day after day and night after night.

Anyway, after my brother’s death I moved to US to recover from all this but I hit rock bottom instead. Suddenly I found myself in the middle of nowhere. No family, no friends, no nothing. Just a bunch of strangers. I was too shy to actually confide in anyone so I'd stay quiet most of the time. I had absolutely no desire to live. None.  Everyday was a drag. I'd just go to different graveyards and spend all my time there during the day. I weighed only 92 pounds at one point. I was a student but I had to drop out because I was in no shape to actually continue both physically and mentally. And I wouldn't seek any therapy because there was no one to force me and I wasn't really looking forward to get better. I went through a lot of soul searching around that time and I'd spend almost all my time in the library. I was just looking for some answers before I thought I'd go away too. Anyway, it took me 5 long years to finally recover from it, and  it was the hardest thing I ever had to do. I still get nightmares and wake up in the middle of the time.  

I did move around a lot since then so obviously when you move around so much, you lose friends and family and it's not easy to make friends this way. In the process you become more and more lonely. I am without my family for a long time now. I did have boyfriends from time to time but for some reason, I wasn't very keen on making a family with them. Probably I didn't think they were the ones or maybe I wasn't ready yet. I thought I needed to sort my life out first.

Anyway, just wanted to tell you that I do have first hand experience otherwise I wouldn't have talked about it at all. I recovered and I recovered completely on my own without any help from anyone. I thought about many things in my down time and they sort of opened my eyes. Eckhart Tolle, one of my favourite writers, was clinically depressed for a number of years. He was also a very lonely person but he got out of it completely on his own. I like that about him because I can relate to his condition. Some fights I feel are worth fighting for and it’s such a different life afterwards. Suddenly life stands in front o you with an entirely different meaning.

If I were in Whitney’s position, I’d probably put my daughter’s interest first before I completely destroy myself. I, at least, owe that much to her since I was responsible for bringing her into this world. Life is just too precious for me especially others. It's true we mostly live in grey areas and things aren't as black and white but I never said that it was. You concluded it on your own. Drugs are only an option and that's all there's to it.  


That isn't clinical depression. That is a very rational form of depression. It isn't the same thing.

I'm sorry, Emma Jean, but recalling tough times in your life does not mean you have the right or the experience to **** on people who suffer from addictions. Your view of addiction is extremely simplistic.
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Emma Jean
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Addiction and depression « Reply #34 on: February 16, 2012, 01:00 AM »
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It's not simplistic but a very realistic one.

There are children who can't even afford one decent meal a day but they still live on because they feel may be better days are ahead. Then there are people, rich people at that, can't take life as it is because it's feels just too much so they buy drugs to get addicted instead. I don't know which life is harder.

Addiction is a fancy problem for those who need comfort all the time. You should visit some of the poor countries and get a reality check for a change. In fact, live in one of them if you can. Maybe then you will understand what's really causing these addictions.  This is your society’s standard byproduct just like you are also 3rd most obese country in the world. You are literally eating yourself to death and then you go and try another addiction to get out of it.

My friend’s father died recently at 54 because his father was an alcoholic so he thought he should be one too. His daughter however feels different and won't touch alcohol at all if you get my facking drift, Clydey.
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Emma Jean
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Addiction and depression « Reply #35 on: February 16, 2012, 01:06 AM »
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You've obviously had it tough and I'm sorry that you went through that.

I wonder what strength would be required to turn down drugs that are essentially being offered to you direct and FREE whilst suffering like that. Because that's what it's like being a celebrity around the wrong people.  You're probably a strong woman, unfortunately there are many that are not.

Why are you isolating only celebrities? There are normal people who aren't famous at all with addictions problems. You do know that, right?

I have a friend who was clinically depressed for a long time and he reason was he fell in love with this girl when he was a teenager and he was forced to move away from her. Not only this triggered a depression he was quickly into drugs but how silly is that? As I've mentioned before, it's more of a problem in the developed countries where they can afford such a thing. People who are still trying get past the basic needs can't really afford it.

Was Amy Winehouse lonely? If she was then why don't you explain it to me as to why.
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Clydey
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Addiction and depression « Reply #36 on: February 16, 2012, 01:12 AM »
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It's not simplistic but a very realistic one.

There are children who can't even afford one decent meal a day but they still live on because they feel may be better days are ahead. Then there are people, rich people at that, can't take life as it is because it's feels just too much so they buy drugs to get addicted instead. I don't know which life is harder.

You don't get it. Clinical depression isn't rational. It's a chemical imbalance in the brain. It has nothing to do with your circumstances, so stop being so ignorant.

Quote
Addiction is a fancy problem for those who need comfort all the time. You should visit some of the poor countries and get a reality check for a change. In fact, live in one of them if you can. Maybe then you will understand what's really causing these addictions.  This is your society’s standard byproduct just like you are also 3rd most obese country in the world. You are literally eating yourself to death and then you go and try another addiction to get out of it.

Do you even know the difference between clinical depression and rational depression? Educate yourself before getting involved in these discussions.

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My friend’s father died recently at 54 because his father was an alcoholic so he thought he should be one too. His daughter however feels different and won't touch alcohol at all if you get my facking drift, Clydey.


What does that have to do with anything? It isn't related to anything I have said.
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Mark
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Addiction and depression « Reply #37 on: February 16, 2012, 01:13 AM »
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Why are you isolating only celebrities?
I'm emphasising the celebrity scenario simply because this discussion is rooted from the death of a celebrity.

Was Amy Winehouse lonely? If she was then why don't you explain it to me as to why.
I'm more inclined to believe Amy Winehouse was a fool. As I said, there are many different scenarios and none of them should be considered "exceptions" because the subject typically involves such variety.
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Emma Jean
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Addiction and depression « Reply #38 on: February 16, 2012, 01:14 AM »
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I’ve noticed one thing in you people. It's always amazing how quickly you recover from a close death yet you are unable to recover from some challenges in life that’s given to everyone all around the world and you make a big deal about it. Since when all these matters have become bigger than life?
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Mark
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Addiction and depression « Reply #39 on: February 16, 2012, 01:16 AM »
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I’ve noticed one thing in you people. It's always amazing how quickly you recover from a close death yet you are unable to recover from some challenges in life that’s given to everyone all around the world and you make a big deal about it. Since when all these matters have become bigger than life?
This post made no sense whatsoever.
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Clydey
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Addiction and depression « Reply #40 on: February 16, 2012, 01:16 AM »
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I’ve noticed one thing in you people. It's always amazing how quickly you recover from a close death yet you are unable to recover from some challenges in life that’s given to everyone all around the world and you make a big deal about it. Since when all these matters have become bigger than life?

What are you talking about? Who are you even referring to?
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Emma Jean
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Addiction and depression « Reply #41 on: February 16, 2012, 01:25 AM »
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Clydey, when will you ever get that we are actually talking about addiction problems here and what truly causes it? I've already said that it's voluntary not forced. No matter how depressed you are, you are perfectly in good position to understand that this is only going to get worse.  Obviously you know it yet you don't care for it.

Today’s human beings are all about these bloody excuses. Send this very people back to Stone Age and then see what they have to say.
I am sorry but I don’t and never will sympathize with people like Whitney Houston or Amy Winehouse. If they really tried hard, they would have lived a better life. By dying like this they only want more attention. Maybe they just want to live on forever even in their death in case everyone forgets about them. Who knows. I almost never trust celebrities. 

I am perfectly willing to sympathize with a real person with real problems. In fact, I do a lot of volunteer work.
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Emma Jean
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Addiction and depression « Reply #42 on: February 16, 2012, 01:28 AM »
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This post made no sense whatsoever.

If you feel my depression was normal because I only faced some close deaths as opposed to yours, which is God knows what, then I am just as much lost.

Do me a favour and watch some real stories. Read books and see how they overcame their depression and addictions. May be you will get a clue even.
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Clydey
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Addiction and depression « Reply #43 on: February 16, 2012, 01:31 AM »
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Clydey, when will you ever get that we are actually talking about addiction problems here and what truly causes it? I've already said that it's voluntary not forced. No matter how depressed you are, you are perfectly in good position to understand that this is only going to get worse.  Obviously you know it yet you don't care for it.

Because addiction is often related to depression, particularly when it comes to opiate addiction.

You have not suffered from clinical depression, nor have you studied it. Your words come from a position of ignorance.

Quote
Today’s human beings are all about these bloody excuses. Send this very people back to Stone Age and then see what they have to say.
I am sorry but I don’t and never will sympathize with people like Whitney Houston or Amy Winehouse. If they really tried hard, they would have lived a better life. By dying like this they only want more attention. Maybe they just want to live on forever even in their death in case everyone forgets about them. Who knows. I almost never trust celebrities. 

What an absolute idiot you are. You just don't listen. Send them back to the Stone Age? For the 10th time, it is rarely about one's surroundings or the state of one's life.

Quote
I am perfectly willing to sympathize with a real person with real problems. In fact, I do a lot of volunteer work.


And addiction isn't a real problem?

Tell me what real problems are, so I can pick them apart and tell you how to deal with them, despite likely having no experience with them.
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Clydey
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Addiction and depression « Reply #44 on: February 16, 2012, 01:33 AM »
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If you feel my depression was normal because I only faced some close deaths as opposed to yours, which is God knows what, then I am just as much lost.

Do me a favour and watch some real stories. Read books and see how they overcame their depression and addictions. May be you will get a clue even.

Your depression was not clinical. It was a rational form of depression, directly related to your circumstances. If you suffer from clinical depression, you very rarely overcome it. It tends to be with you for life. It is neurobiological problem for the most part.
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