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Author Topic: Benefits and financial support  (Read 8214 times)
Joe
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Boo hoo hoooooooo :'(

Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #570 on: April 03, 2013, 11:22 AM »
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It really sucks. Bedroom tax is an outrage. I just wonder how much of the damage Labour will undo, or be able to undo, when they get in, which should be next election.

The annoying thing is, if people didn't vote against their own interests, there would never be a Tory government.

Unfortunately, I think Labour will do very little to reverse the coalition's scorched-earth tactics if/when they get in in 2015. They've been a pathetic opposition since 2010, doing well in the polls based mainly on the coalition's unpopularity rather than any policies of their own. Under Blair, they turned away from their traditional beliefs and have become a sort of Tory-lite, as much in thrall to big business, the rich and lobbyists as Cameron's lot.

It's a real shame, but I can't see much of a viable alternative anymore for an English voter leaning to the Left. I'll probably go Green for the next election - I voted for them in the London Mayor elections last year, but instead we got Boris, along with his celebrity persona and meaningless, self-serving prattle which appeals to Tories and the hard of thinking. Unfortunately, the Greens aren't likely to make much impact anywhere as their message is all too easily discredited by the vested interests doing well out of the status quo, but take a stand and vote for them I shall. As much as I think Alex Salmond and his independence ideas are foolish, at least Scotland has a credible alternative to the main three parties that is doing something tangible for the Scots.
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Iluvandy
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #571 on: April 03, 2013, 12:00 PM »
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Independence is looking less foolish every day.     Never did look all that foolish to me anyway as I can't think how many years it is since I had a government even close to my way of thinking.   Labour will do no good even if they do get in - it will still be the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and the de'il tak the hindmost.
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Littlebuddha
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #572 on: April 03, 2013, 02:14 PM »
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I agree Iluvandy each day that goes by I am more convinced about independence for Scotland is the best thing for us. We have never loved the Tories they are a bunch of rich spoiled  boys who do not have had to go without anything. The more I see Osbourne the sicker I feel. My daughter who has never had any thoughts about independence say she will vote for it. She has never talked about politics in her life but told us the other day that she will vote as it is so important.Why don't the Tories start to look at all the multi millionaires and the city who are fleecing the tax system left right and center. Put your rich friends in order George because they are the one's who are pulling the wool over your eyes.
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blueberryhill
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #573 on: April 03, 2013, 04:22 PM »
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It's a bloody joke.


On radio this a.m was a woman who had been on anti-depressants for 19 years shocking She'd been put on them initially to help her get through a divorce.
What on earth was her GP thinking of?
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Iluvandy
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #574 on: April 03, 2013, 06:52 PM »
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On radio this a.m was a woman who had been on anti-depressants for 19 years shocking She'd been put on them initially to help her get through a divorce.
What on earth was her GP thinking of?

Offered as standard for divorce, bereavement etc. sleeping tablets and anti-depressants.    Very few make a distinction between depression and grief.    Grief is a process everyone has to go through at some stage in their lives.       
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Bevc
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #575 on: April 03, 2013, 10:23 PM »
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It's no different over here ILA no

Then's there's this I had heard about but can't find anything recent.

Doctors are concerned about the number of children and young people being prescribed anti-depressants.

Pharmac figures showed about 3000 anti-depressant prescriptions for children aged under 13 were filled in 2010, and about 14,000 for teenagers aged 13 to 17.


http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/5607415/Number-of-children-on-anti-depressants-concerns

Sorry, but I'm very wtf about this.
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DaveH
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #576 on: April 03, 2013, 11:03 PM »
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Unfortunately, I think Labour will do very little to reverse the coalition's scorched-earth tactics if/when they get in in 2015. They've been a pathetic opposition since 2010, doing well in the polls based mainly on the coalition's unpopularity rather than any policies of their own. Under Blair, they turned away from their traditional beliefs and have become a sort of Tory-lite, as much in thrall to big business, the rich and lobbyists as Cameron's lot.

It's a real shame, but I can't see much of a viable alternative anymore for an English voter leaning to the Left. I'll probably go Green for the next election

There are still significant differences between the Tories and Labour. If your constituency is a safe Labour seat then fair enough.
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DaveH
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #577 on: April 03, 2013, 11:49 PM »
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Of the people faking depression, a lot of them probably are depressed but don't realise it. Who wants to sit at home all day, interacting with and meeting no new colleagues, only having a low income, not having daily challenges, with no prospect of improvement, and having the social stigma of unemployment? Only the depressed, and some of those who are from the meanest backgrounds (who are de facto likely to be depressed).

None of this is an excuse for what ATOS are doing. 1300 people have died after being declared fit for work. People have committed suicide.

There is no system in place to ensure that ATOS get medical reports from GPs before the assessment takes place. Certain vulnerable people shouldn't have to go through the stress of an assessment at all.   Then if they fail the very brief tick box assessment, which is not good for diagnosing mental illness especially, they have all the stress and worry of an appeal, and living on a lower amount of money, which the most organised and lucid person finds a severe challenge.

Get this: 43% of the people who have been found fit to work are neither working nor receiving benefits. There are a lot of vulnerable people falling through the cracks.

Over 20% of negative assessments are overturned on appeal, which is again many hundreds of thousands of lives negatively impacted through no fault of their own.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2013/jan/17/atos-attack-emotional-commons-debate

As for the bedroom tax, there is NO justifying it. There are not enough smaller homes for people to move into anyway.

I am SO sick of privileged people demonising and exploiting the poor.
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Bevc
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #578 on: April 04, 2013, 03:44 AM »
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I get what you're saying Dave but I'm a bit concerned about this fact:-

Get this: 43% of the people who have been found fit to work are neither working nor receiving benefits. There are a lot of vulnerable people falling through the cracks.
43% of how many?

Also, 3.2 million on DLA - that's a lot of people.  Then include the IC benefits. 

As for the bedroom tax, there is NO justifying it. There are not enough smaller homes for people to move into anyway.


Yep.  Offer smaller accommodation in the same area, if it's turned down, then they pay the higher rate.  If there's no smaller accommodation available in that area, then shutup 

My mum& dad moved to smaller accommodation when we all moved out and it was just a couple of streets away from where they lived.
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DaveH
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #579 on: April 04, 2013, 05:27 AM »
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I get what you're saying Dave but I'm a bit concerned about this fact:-

Get this: 43% of the people who have been found fit to work are neither working nor receiving benefits. There are a lot of vulnerable people falling through the cracks.
43% of how many?

43% of 771,100 up to November 2011. So more than that now. 43% of 771,100 is  331, 573 people who have no work or benefits.

http://statistics.dwp.gov.uk/asd/asd1/adhoc_analysis/2012/ESA_Atos_recommendations_post_appeal_WCA_outcomes.pdf

These are the DWP's own stats.


Not to forget the 1300 who have died, including suicides.

Quote
Also, 3.2 million on DLA - that's a lot of people.  Then include the IC benefits.

False claimants does not justify the neglect of genuine claimants, including the most vulnerable in society. Over 300,000 people who are not in the system at all - not working and not getting benefits any more. That is huge.

Anyhow, what is the number of genuine claimants? This is not known.
  
Quote

As for the bedroom tax, there is NO justifying it. There are not enough smaller homes for people to move into anyway.


Yep.  Offer smaller accommodation in the same area, if it's turned down, then they pay the higher rate.  If there's no smaller accommodation available in that area, then shutup  

My mum& dad moved to smaller accommodation when we all moved out and it was just a couple of streets away from where they lived.

 There are not enough smaller homes for people to move into. The government has admitted this. These people do not get exemption from the tax.

Taxing the poor for having a spare bedroom is ridiculous. Taxing the poor for having a spare bedroom when the situation cannot be remedied is scandalous. Of all the places to get tax money from! Especially as this includes people in wheelchairs, and parents with (three bedrooms and) two children under ten are counted as having a spare room.
[ Last edit by DaveH April 04, 2013, 05:40 AM ] IP Logged
blueberryhill
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #580 on: April 04, 2013, 07:13 AM »
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@Dave H
A lot of research was done, in the 80s I think, about ant-depressants being doled out to people who ought to be angry about their circumstances, rather than depressed eg women with babies put into high rise flats. I believe women are far more likely to be given anti-depressants anyway and could certainly offer a feminist analysis as to why this is. And yes, I know one of the reasons is that women are more likely to visit their doctors but....
@iluvandy
The last Labour Government inherited shocking child poverty figures from the Tories and had made great efforts to bring them down and were succeeding. Watch them rise sky high again now.
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Bevc
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #581 on: April 04, 2013, 09:29 AM »
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43% of 771,100 up to November 2011. So more than that now. 43% of 771,100 is  331, 573 people who have no work or benefits.

http://statistics.dwp.gov.uk/asd/asd1/adhoc_analysis/2012/ESA_Atos_recommendations_post_appeal_WCA_outcomes.pdf

These are the DWP's own stats.


Not to forget the 1300 who have died, including suicides.

False claimants does not justify the neglect of genuine claimants, including the most vulnerable in society. Over 300,000 people who are not in the system at all - not working and not getting benefits any more. That is huge.

Anyhow, what is the number of genuine claimants? This is not known.
 
 There are not enough smaller homes for people to move into. The government has admitted this. These people do not get exemption from the tax.

Taxing the poor for having a spare bedroom is ridiculous. Taxing the poor for having a spare bedroom when the situation cannot be remedied is scandalous. Of all the places to get tax money from! Especially as this includes people in wheelchairs, and parents with (three bedrooms and) two children under ten are counted as having a spare room.

Thanks for the info.


The deaths are a tragedy.


I'm surprised ATOS hasn't been sued.


I realise that there is going to be lack of smaller accommodation units.  My parents waited probably 2 years for their one bedroomed unit.  And I can understand the uproar on the most part but knowing someone that played the system until they were better off than me and my hubby working kind of leaves a bitter taste in your mouth.
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Caz
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #582 on: April 04, 2013, 10:20 AM »
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I know how you feel Bev. I've known several people like that and having worked hard all my life, I feel very bitter about it too! I'm sorry if mistakes as being made and deserving people are falling through the net and feel the Government needs to do something to make sure that this cannot happen, but I'm not sorry that they are cracking down on it. This is long overdue and I still cannot understand why almost a third of the people on disability benefit have refused to take the medical!
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Littlebuddha
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #583 on: April 04, 2013, 11:31 AM »
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Perhaps Caz they will not go for a medical because of  the creeps who are doing them. ATOS are a bunch of cow towing arseholes who are out to take people of benefits for the government. Too many people who are genuine are being deprived of the benefits they are entitled to by idiots who should not be doing medicals they follow a script and would not have a clue. Eg Hazel and others on this site have been told she can work because she can lift a piece of paper. She is in a lot of pain and faints frequently how can she work ? some days are better than others. You cannot expect people to work with that kind of condition.It is just a government scam to reduce the welfare bill.
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Caz
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Re: Benefits and financial support « Reply #584 on: April 04, 2013, 12:01 PM »
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LB......People who have refused to take the medical are no longer getting the benefit anyway, so they have 'nothing to lose' by taking it, unless of course, they have something to hide!
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