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Bible discussion thread

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Joe
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #30 on: July 28, 2010, 03:57 PM »
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Even in context, God of the Old Testament comes off sounding a bit like a tyrant dictator.

He was ice cold but, like Saul on the road to Damascus, he had some sort of epiphany and was much more friendly in the sequel. Teenage angst in the Old Testament perhaps?
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Hazybear
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #31 on: July 28, 2010, 07:11 PM »
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Even in context, God of the Old Testament comes off sounding a bit like a tyrant dictator.

I always come back to the parent analogy I'm afraid. Now yes our parents are only human and can be wrong, but imagine the perfect parent who really does know best. When we do wrong and get into trouble then we deserve punishment (told off) for it. In the OT that sometimes meant an actual punishment, however, from the NT Jesus took that punishment on our behalf. I sometimes think of it that God views us through Christ-tinted glasses Smile

I suppose it's easier for me having grown up and been taught that God loves me and having the OT explained in terms of God's plan for salvation and God being the parent to his children (the Israelites later called Jews)
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George183
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #32 on: August 04, 2010, 01:09 PM »
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Even in context, God of the Old Testament comes off sounding a bit like a tyrant dictator.

Very true!  Which unfortunate misapprehension God sent His Son Jesus Christ to correct of course.

John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. ...

John 14:6  Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

John 8:32  Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free." ...

John 11:9    Seek and ye shall find.

Matthew 22:37-40  37. Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38. This is the first and great commandment. 39. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Mark 12:23  29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. 31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

Luke 10:26  What is written in the law? how readest thou? 27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. 28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right:


Okay I know from both our standpoints that we'll never agree on why God is allowed to judge and punish.

God is not allowed to judge or punish. That was a mistake made by the vindictive Old Testament prophets which God sent his Son Jesus Christ to correct, as reflected in the three Gospels saying exactly the same thing about the over-riding New Testament Commandments which God sent Jesus to reveal.
 
Quote
Also will highlight that while I don't hold the belief that everything in the OT was seen as rubbish after the coming of Christ and his teachings to fulfil the law, which was laid out in the OT;

Right. God sent His Son, and his infallible teachings to fulfil the OT law, and correct it, so that we would can know the Truth about God:

that He is Love, and nothing else,

and that we should love God and our neighbour as we love ourself, as God loves us,

and seek the Truth, because the Truth will set us free,

and that God will give us His love and strength to help us do His Will,

and provide us with a purpose in life, which we will find both therapeutic and fulfilling, which will enhance our health and survival, and the health and survival of our species, through the loving and caring cooperation of its members.
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Mark
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #33 on: August 04, 2010, 01:12 PM »
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Frankly God, as represented in the Bible as a whole, is a tyrant. Can you imagine a merciful and loving God allowing the existence of a torture chamber where just because someone chooses not to support him, they get sent there for eternity? No, at least a merciful God would not allow the existence of such a place and would just put an end to your existence peacefully. I don't care if Satan is responsible, God is more powerful and is choosing to allow for it to exist.
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George183
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #34 on: August 04, 2010, 01:22 PM »
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Frankly God, as represented in the Bible as a whole, is a tyrant. Can you imagine a merciful and loving God allowing the existence of a torture chamber where just because someone chooses not to support him, they get sent there for eternity? No, at least a merciful God would not allow the existence of such a place and would just put an end to your existence peacefully. I don't care if Satan is responsible, God is more powerful and is choosing to allow for it to exist.

I dunno, Mark. I’m not an expert on the Old Testament. I don’t quite know to what you are referring.

All I know is that everything in the Bible is wrong, if it conflicts with Christ’s teachings that God is love, because Christ is the expert, and Christianity is based on what he taught, and nothing else.

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Mark
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #35 on: August 04, 2010, 01:24 PM »
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it conflicts with Christ’s teachings that God is love,
It certainly does, if Christ teaches that God is love and yet he will still send a person who lived a moral life to hell for eternity, then God is not love.
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George183
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #36 on: August 04, 2010, 01:32 PM »
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It certainly does, if Christ teaches that God is love and yet he will still send a person who lived a moral life to hell for eternity, then God is not love.

There is no such thing as hell, damnation, judgement day, or anything else. It is all the figment of a vindictive imagination.

As you say it would not be loving, and so is inconsistent with a loving God, which Christ teaches us God is.

You are worrying for nothing. Heaven is a parallel universe which we can enter now, and where we can live a parallel existence, in loving communion with God and our loved ones, forever, or not, as we wish.
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Mark
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #37 on: August 04, 2010, 01:45 PM »
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I'm worried for your sanity because you are so confident of so many things you couldn't possibly have any idea about. Heaven is a parallel universe? lol
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Daisy
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #38 on: August 04, 2010, 02:16 PM »
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There is no such thing as hell, damnation, judgement day, or anything else. It is all the figment of a vindictive imagination.

As you say it would not be loving, and so is inconsistent with a loving God, which Christ teaches us God is.

You are worrying for nothing. Heaven is a parallel universe which we can enter now, and where we can live a parallel existence, in loving communion with God and our loved ones, forever, or not, as we wish.


Love the thought of that George ..... do they take just anyone or is it Christians only?
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George183
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #39 on: August 04, 2010, 06:13 PM »
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I'm worried for your sanity because you are so confident of so many things you couldn't possibly have any idea about. Heaven is a parallel universe? lol 

“couldn't possibly have any idea about.”?  You are joking aren’t you? Everybody knows about parallel universes.



http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/horizon/2001/paralleluni.shtml

“Heaven is a parallel universe?”  Absolutely. There is nothing else it can be, if it exists at all.



Love the thought of that George ..... do they take just anyone or is it Christians only?

Yep! Anyone! Just knock on the door and walk in.  All the more the merrier!!  Wouldn’t like to think you weren’t here, with me, Daisy!!

John 11:9   “Knock, and it shall be opened unto you.”
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Daisy
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #40 on: August 04, 2010, 06:16 PM »
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Going to read up on this ....

Read the link and that is the kind of thing that makes my mind expand right outside the box ... fascinating ... wow ...
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Daisy
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #41 on: August 04, 2010, 06:27 PM »
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George .... I keep getting this sneaky feeling that you are creeping up on me with great stealth in the hope that you are going to convert me from my heathen ways and that I wont notice ..... you're not really doing that, are you George? lol
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George183
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #42 on: August 04, 2010, 08:23 PM »
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George .... I keep getting this sneaky feeling that you are creeping up on me with great stealth in the hope that you are going to convert me from my heathen ways and that I wont notice ..... you're not really doing that, are you George? lol

As iffffffff !!!  Very Happy

But I dooooo have a sneaking feeling that you've crept in around here, somewhere.  I'm definitely feeling the vibessssss !!  Very Happy
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Daisy
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #43 on: August 04, 2010, 08:27 PM »
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As iffffffff !!!  Very Happy

But I dooooo have a sneaking feeling that you've crept in around here, somewhere.  I'm definitely feeling the vibessssss !!  Very Happy

No no George .... that's most probably your neighbour's zimmer that's creating the "vibes" ... lol
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George183
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Re: Bible Discussion thread « Reply #44 on: August 04, 2010, 08:30 PM »
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No no George .... that's most probably your neighbour's zimmer that's creating the "vibes" ... lol

Ya reckon?  There's definitely more to life than meets the eye, Dais.  Smile
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