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Free will

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Hazybear
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Re: Free will « Reply #105 on: April 05, 2012, 10:06 PM »
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Lost the plot myself long time ago.... so my brain told me before I was conscious of it.

A truer statement was never known :P
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Mark
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Re: Free will « Reply #106 on: April 05, 2012, 10:08 PM »
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It all sounds to me like our brain is essentially a sentient being capable of producing thoughts and reasoning while you are just witnessing the way it wants to live life with your body.
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robbie
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Re: Free will « Reply #107 on: April 05, 2012, 10:11 PM »
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A truer statement was never known :P
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Clydey
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Re: Free will « Reply #108 on: April 05, 2012, 10:12 PM »
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It all sounds to me like our brain is essentially a sentient being capable of producing thoughts and reasoning while you are just witnessing the way it wants to live life with your body.

Take out the sentient part and that's fairly accurate. It's a remarkable thing to come to terms with, that it also gives rise to consciousness which in turn allows us to become aware of this fact.
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robbie
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Re: Free will « Reply #109 on: April 05, 2012, 10:12 PM »
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It all sounds to me like our brain is essentially a sentient being capable of producing thoughts and reasoning while you are just witnessing the way it wants to live life with your body.
Mark... Time for  zz
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Mark
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Re: Free will « Reply #110 on: April 05, 2012, 10:14 PM »
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Take out the sentient part and that's fairly accurate. It's a remarkable thing to come to terms with, that it also gives rise to consciousness which in turn allows us to become aware of this fact.
Why the need to take out the sentient part? The idea that it is behind our actual thoughts rather than our consciousness suggests to me a self-aware organism of sorts.

Mark... Time for  zz
Talk to my brain, not me.
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Hazybear
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Re: Free will « Reply #111 on: April 05, 2012, 10:16 PM »
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It all sounds to me like our brain is essentially a sentient being capable of producing thoughts and reasoning while you are just witnessing the way it wants to live life with your body.

 confused Isn't that just another way of saying that our brain is the powerhouse of our body? The brain thinks and the body responds-that isn't a particularly new concept Smile I get what James is saying but for me just saying that before we are consciously aware of making a decision doesn't mean that that decision is not ours. Our brain is part of us-so just because it responds to something as it informs 'us' i.e. our body and awareness, doesn't mean that 'we' (our brain included) didn't make that decision.
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Clydey
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Re: Free will « Reply #112 on: April 05, 2012, 10:17 PM »
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Why the need to take out the sentient part? The idea that it is behind our actual thoughts rather than our consciousness suggests to me a self-aware organism of sorts.


We are the self-aware part of our brain. The brain without consciousness is simply unconscious processes.
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Mark
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Re: Free will « Reply #113 on: April 05, 2012, 10:18 PM »
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for me just saying that before we are consciously aware of making a decision doesn't mean that that decision is not ours.
That's my feeling on it too - that there is a delay in our perception but we could have still made that decision. Like looking in a delayed mirror and only when we see it in the mirror do we recognise it as happening.
[ Last edit by Mark April 05, 2012, 10:23 PM ] IP Logged
scotnadian
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You (still) ain't seen nothing yet..

Re: Free will « Reply #114 on: April 05, 2012, 10:21 PM »
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Who/what is working our brain? (asking from a non-religious pov)
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Mark
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Re: Free will « Reply #115 on: April 05, 2012, 10:22 PM »
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The whole fact that we know so little about our consciousness fills me with doubt over such an earth shattering claim. I wish this could be scientifically scrutinised but apparently not.
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robbie
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Re: Free will « Reply #116 on: April 05, 2012, 10:22 PM »
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Talk to my brain, not me.
Are you genetically consciously able to understand?
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Clydey
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Re: Free will « Reply #117 on: April 05, 2012, 10:24 PM »
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confused Isn't that just another way of saying that our brain is the powerhouse of our body? The brain thinks and the body responds-that isn't a particularly new concept Smile I get what James is saying but for me just saying that before we are consciously aware of making a decision doesn't mean that that decision is not ours. Our brain is part of us-so just because it responds to something as it informs 'us' i.e. our body and awareness, doesn't mean that 'we' (our brain included) didn't make that decision.

That's a compatibilist argument: if we are anything, we are our brain; therefore, if the brain makes choices, we make choices.

This argument doesn't stand up to scrutiny, though. That is not how free will is commonly perceived. Using the compatibilist argument, you would be forced to state that you are choosing to do everything the brain is doing. Are you currently choosing to regulate dopamine levels in your brain? No, your brain is simply doing that. It requires no effort on your part. And when I say 'you', I mean the traditional idea of who you are.
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robbie
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Re: Free will « Reply #118 on: April 05, 2012, 10:24 PM »
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Who/what is working our brain? (asking from a non-religious pov)
First.... get one.
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scotnadian
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Re: Free will « Reply #119 on: April 05, 2012, 10:26 PM »
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First.... get one.
Can I borrow yours, seeing as you think it's better than mine?
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