Home Search Calendar Help Login Register
Did you miss your activation email?
Andy Murray vs Fabio Fognini, Thursday, Estimated time - 1:45pm BST - Discuss the match
MurraysWorld Discussions  >  General Community  >  Chit Chat  >  Free will 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
Pages: 1 ... 30 31 32 [33] 34 35 36 ... 44 Go Down Reply
Author

Free will

 (Read 8215 times)
laundry
Top Seed
*****
Posts: 5,665

Gender: Male
Location: Lincolnshire


Re: Free will « Reply #480 on: March 10, 2013, 12:19 AM »
Reply

It's not a well defined concept, but the conventional notion is that we are the authors of our own actions.
And how do you define 'we'?
IP Logged
Clydey
Murraymaniac
**********
Posts: 22,174

Gender: Male
Location: Scotland


Re: Free will « Reply #481 on: March 10, 2013, 12:20 AM »
Reply

And how do you define 'we'?

Humans.
IP Logged
Iluvandy
Seed
****
Posts: 4,702

Gender: Female
Location: Scotland


Re: Free will « Reply #482 on: March 10, 2013, 12:31 AM »
Reply

It's not a well defined concept, but the conventional notion is that we are the authors of our own actions.



But only within certain constraints and I believe we are strongly influenced by genes and environment but not bound by them.
IP Logged
Clydey
Murraymaniac
**********
Posts: 22,174

Gender: Male
Location: Scotland


Re: Free will « Reply #483 on: March 10, 2013, 12:33 AM »
Reply

But only within certain constraints and I believe we are strongly influenced by genes and environment but not bound by them.

It's not just influence. We *are* or genes and our environment. Literally nothing else factors into who we are.
IP Logged
laundry
Top Seed
*****
Posts: 5,665

Gender: Male
Location: Lincolnshire


Re: Free will « Reply #484 on: March 10, 2013, 12:41 AM »
Reply

It's not just influence. We *are* or genes and our environment. Literally nothing else factors into who we are.
Well then that is your proper definition of 'human'.
[ Last edit by laundry March 10, 2013, 01:03 AM ] IP Logged
Mark
Murraymaniac
*
Posts: 53,066

Gender: Male
Location: London


Re: Free will « Reply #485 on: March 10, 2013, 12:46 AM »
Reply

Well then that is your proper definition of 'human'.
Machines for the sole purpose of hosting our genes and ensuring their survival. That's one common way of looking at it.
IP Logged
Iluvandy
Seed
****
Posts: 4,702

Gender: Female
Location: Scotland


Re: Free will « Reply #486 on: March 10, 2013, 12:51 AM »
Reply

I find my age is a factor in who I am.   Does that come under the heading of environment?    I know it cannot be proved but I believe I followed the example of one of my parents whose philosophy seemed to suit me.    It definitely felt that it was a path I selected.
IP Logged
Iluvandy
Seed
****
Posts: 4,702

Gender: Female
Location: Scotland


Re: Free will « Reply #487 on: March 10, 2013, 12:55 AM »
Reply

Machines for the sole purpose of hosting our genes and ensuring their survival. That's one common way of looking at it.

And who came up with that silly idea.    Why must our genes survive.    The planet could do just as well, in fact better, without us.
without us.
IP Logged
Mark
Murraymaniac
*
Posts: 53,066

Gender: Male
Location: London


Re: Free will « Reply #488 on: March 10, 2013, 12:56 AM »
Reply

The feeling being the illusion given to us for the sake of making the position of observer comfortable.

So the theory goes. And to me, that is what it is. James believes it is fact but compelling logic is not enough for me. I still need one of two things: A full understanding of the soul, which still remains a mystery to us OR an undisputed scientific experiment proving this theory.

Until then, my default position is that free will is probably not real.
IP Logged
Clydey
Murraymaniac
**********
Posts: 22,174

Gender: Male
Location: Scotland


Re: Free will « Reply #489 on: March 10, 2013, 12:58 AM »
Reply

I find my age is a factor in who I am.   Does that come under the heading of environment?    I know it cannot be proved but I believe I followed the example of one of my parents whose philosophy seemed to suit me.    It definitely felt that it was a path I selected.

All experience falls under the category of environment. From the moment you are born, the environment is essentially interacting with your genes to make you who you are.
IP Logged
Clydey
Murraymaniac
**********
Posts: 22,174

Gender: Male
Location: Scotland


Re: Free will « Reply #490 on: March 10, 2013, 01:01 AM »
Reply

The feeling being the illusion given to us for the sake of making the position of observer comfortable.

So the theory goes. And to me, that is what it is. James believes it is fact but compelling logic is not enough for me. I still need one of two things: A full understanding of the soul, which still remains a mystery to us OR an undisputed scientific experiment proving this theory.


Did you mean to say consciousness?
IP Logged
Clydey
Murraymaniac
**********
Posts: 22,174

Gender: Male
Location: Scotland


Re: Free will « Reply #491 on: March 10, 2013, 01:03 AM »
Reply

And who came up with that silly idea.    Why must our genes survive.    The planet could do just as well, in fact better, without us.
without us.

It's not that they must survive. There is no ultimate purpose behind it. We're simply driven to survive. All species adapt to survive.
IP Logged
Mark
Murraymaniac
*
Posts: 53,066

Gender: Male
Location: London


Re: Free will « Reply #492 on: March 10, 2013, 01:03 AM »
Reply

Did you mean to say consciousness?
Yes. Logic says it's simply a result of advanced brain development. But it's still a pretty big mystery.
IP Logged
laundry
Top Seed
*****
Posts: 5,665

Gender: Male
Location: Lincolnshire


Re: Free will « Reply #493 on: March 10, 2013, 01:05 AM »
Reply

Machines for the sole purpose of hosting our genes and ensuring their survival. That's one common way of looking at it.
Yes that's pretty much it. Humans are an assembly of natural materials shaped by a genetic code acting upon the surrounding environment.

When you then try to apply a concept such as 'free will' upon such a concoction what are you really asking? Whether the interactions between grown neurons through this process can react to an environment independently from themselves? Such a notion is clearly illogical and provides no insight into anything.
IP Logged
Iluvandy
Seed
****
Posts: 4,702

Gender: Female
Location: Scotland


Re: Free will « Reply #494 on: March 10, 2013, 01:05 AM »
Reply

All experience falls under the category of environment. From the moment you are born, the environment is essentially interacting with your genes to make you who you are.

But surely I can select from my environment - favour some bits - ignore other bits - ignore my age!!!   
IP Logged
Pages: 1 ... 30 31 32 [33] 34 35 36 ... 44 Go Up Reply 
« previous next »