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News Thread

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blueberryhill
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8400 on: September 19, 2013, 10:47 AM »
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angie:
Please can you email change.org and inform them. There's a link at the bottom of the page.
Just checked site and only about 17, thousand signatures to go.
Also saw an old school friend I  emailed had just signed. Felt all soppy....
Am just off to write some letters, yes I know old-fashioned, moi....
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angiebabez
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Andy Murray Wimbledon Champion 2013

Re: News Thread « Reply #8401 on: September 19, 2013, 11:22 AM »
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OK Smile
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Aileen
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8402 on: September 19, 2013, 05:20 PM »
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Just checked site and only about 17, thousand signatures to go.
Hmm - no change since then unfortunately, unless it's somehow got stuck in a time warp on my computer.
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IonaRed
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8403 on: September 19, 2013, 11:28 PM »
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Is anybody watching BBC Question Time? They were discussing the full-face niqab veil. They talk as though non-muslims all walk about wearing whatever we like. We don't. I had a strict dress code when I was at primary and secondary school. If I turned up to school without a blazer I would have been sent home. At work I have a strict dress code. I can't walk through airport security with a coat or a hat on. There are numerous other examples. I'm stunned at the amount of people that seem to have no problem with these veils.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/16/veil-biggest-issue-uk-niqab-debate
[ Last edit by IonaRed September 19, 2013, 11:32 PM ] IP Logged
Aileen
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8404 on: September 20, 2013, 12:29 AM »
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Is anybody watching BBC Question Time? They were discussing the full-face niqab veil. They talk as though non-muslims all walk about wearing whatever we like. We don't. I had a strict dress code when I was at primary and secondary school. If I turned up to school without a blazer I would have been sent home. At work I have a strict dress code. I can't walk through airport security with a coat or a hat on. There are numerous other examples. I'm stunned at the amount of people that seem to have no problem with these veils.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/16/veil-biggest-issue-uk-niqab-debate

Yes I did watch that long enough to hear that discussion, and I do have a big problem with these veils.  Quite frankly I find them intimidating.  There's something very scary about not being able to see a person's face, just their eyes.

There should not be an national debate on this issue.  It's rumbled on for long enough and our government should have the guts to pass legislation prohibiting the wearing of the niqab in public places, the same as the French have done.  Sadly though this is another glaring example of the government's fear of offending ethnic minorities, but if British people are required to move hats, helmets, balaclavas and any other items which cover or partially cover the face, then I fail to see why Muslim women should be exempt.  The phrase 'When in Rome, etc.' comes to mind.  After all if we were to visit their countries we would be expected to obey their dress code by covering our heads and arms, and if it offends their religious sensibilities so much then they should go back to the countries they came from.  .
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iamabritt
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8405 on: September 20, 2013, 12:58 AM »
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Yes I did watch that long enough to hear that discussion, and I do have a big problem with these veils.  Quite frankly I find them intimidating.  There's something very scary about not being able to see a person's face, just their eyes.

There should not be an national debate on this issue.  It's rumbled on for long enough and our government should have the guts to pass legislation prohibiting the wearing of the niqab in public places, the same as the French have done.  Sadly though this is another glaring example of the government's fear of offending ethnic minorities, but if British people are required to move hats, helmets, balaclavas and any other items which cover or partially cover the face, then I fail to see why Muslim women should be exempt.  The phrase 'When in Rome, etc.' comes to mind.  After all if we were to visit their countries we would be expected to obey their dress code by covering our heads and arms, and if it offends their religious sensibilities so much then they should go back to the countries they came from.  .
Well said Aileen.
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IonaRed
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8406 on: September 20, 2013, 01:36 AM »
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Yes I did watch that long enough to hear that discussion, and I do have a big problem with these veils.  Quite frankly I find them intimidating.  There's something very scary about not being able to see a person's face, just their eyes.

There should not be an national debate on this issue.  It's rumbled on for long enough and our government should have the guts to pass legislation prohibiting the wearing of the niqab in public places, the same as the French have done.  Sadly though this is another glaring example of the government's fear of offending ethnic minorities, but if British people are required to move hats, helmets, balaclavas and any other items which cover or partially cover the face, then I fail to see why Muslim women should be exempt.  The phrase 'When in Rome, etc.' comes to mind.  After all if we were to visit their countries we would be expected to obey their dress code by covering our heads and arms, and if it offends their religious sensibilities so much then they should go back to the countries they came from.  .

I agree Aileen. I also find them intimidating. I wouldn't like to stand beside any person that had their face almost completely covered. I thought the compromise ruling in the recent court case was shocking. It has set a precedent for how criminal courts deal with defendants who wear this veil. So much for all "are equal in the eyes of the law". It seems not. His ruling prohibits courtroom artists from making any sketch or drawing of the defendant without her niqab. I see no reason why defendants' faces should not be visible at all times, including while others are giving evidence. They should not be permitted in classrooms etc. My brother was recently in London. He was at Legoland with my niece who is just 2. He was about to take a photo of her when she suddenly ran screaming towards him. What had she seen? Two women wearing those veils. She was absolutely terrified and I'm not surprised. 
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Aileen
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8407 on: September 20, 2013, 02:18 AM »
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Iona - I was on a bus in Edinburgh a few weeks after the 7/7 London bombings when three persons got on dressed in black from head to toe and wearing the veil.  I use the word 'persons' because they were quite tall and the loose garb they were wearing plus the veil made identifying their sex virtually impossible.  No seats were vacant so they had to stand together in the aisle, which was pretty scary.  Very quickly you could feel a sense of unease among the passengers.  For all we knew they could have been terrorists hell bent on blowing themselves and us up.  Fortunately though they did get off after a few stops.
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tennis_girl
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8408 on: September 20, 2013, 02:43 AM »
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Rolling Eyes

You guys do not get to decide how other people dress because how they dress makes you uncomfortable.
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IonaRed
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8409 on: September 20, 2013, 02:50 AM »
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Iona - I was on a bus in Edinburgh a few weeks after the 7/7 London bombings when three persons got on dressed in black from head to toe and wearing the veil.  I use the word 'persons' because they were quite tall and the loose garb they were wearing plus the veil made identifying their sex virtually impossible.  No seats were vacant so they had to stand together in the aisle, which was pretty scary.  Very quickly you could feel a sense of unease among the passengers.  For all we knew they could have been terrorists hell bent on blowing themselves and us up.  Fortunately though they did get off after a few stops.

Yes, but why would anyone care about how non-muslims feel about being confronted with 'persons' that are completely unidentifiable? It seems how we feel is irrelevant. I'm not surprised that there was a sense of unease on that bus. A few years ago my friend had cancer and lost her hair. It took months for her family to get her out of the house.  I remember speaking to her one day on the phone and she said she had been in a supermarket with her mother.  As she felt uncomfortable about her hair loss she was wearing a headscarf and a cardigan with her hood up. She was approached by a security guard and told she would need to put her hood down. They left the supermarket. They did get an apology from the supermarket at a later date but the store manager did point out that their store policy was that shoppers were not permitted to enter the store with their heads covered. Would they have tried that with a shopper wearing a veil? I doubt it.   
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Aileen
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8410 on: September 20, 2013, 02:59 AM »
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I doubt it too, otherwise the store would have been accused of racism and discrimination and there would have been howls of protest from the ill done to Muslim community. 


Rolling Eyes

You guys do not get to decide how other people dress because how they dress makes you uncomfortable.
If it was just uncomfortable it wouldn't be so bad, but when the way people dress can induce feelings of fear and alarm then I think we have every right to object.  Remember how scary the hoodies were when they went around with their faces almost concealed?  Something was done to try to put an end to that, so why should Muslim women, who aren't even British, be allowed to get away with completely covering everything bar their eyes?
[ Last edit by Aileen September 20, 2013, 03:12 AM ] IP Logged
IonaRed
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8411 on: September 20, 2013, 03:11 AM »
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Rolling Eyes

You guys do not get to decide how other people dress because how they dress makes you uncomfortable.

In certain environments people decide how I dress. Why should they be any different?
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Aileen
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8412 on: September 20, 2013, 03:21 AM »
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In certain environments people decide how I dress. Why should they be any different?
And what about people who are banned from wearing crucifix necklaces in their place of work, yet these women are allowed to flaunt their religious beliefs with impunity.  OK so Sikhs are allowed to wear their turbans, but at least that only covers the top of their heads.
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IonaRed
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8413 on: September 20, 2013, 03:30 AM »
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And what about people who are banned from wearing crucifix necklaces in their place of work, yet these women are allowed to flaunt their religious beliefs with impunity.  OK so Sikhs are allowed to wear their turbans, but at least that only covers the top of their heads.

I've told this story on here before but it's relevant to your mention of the cross. I was an administrator at a university and as part of my job I had to deal with payments etc to our PhD students for the teaching they did as part of their course. I remember being introduced to 10 students. On a weekly basis they all had to come and see me to go through various things.  I remember having to email one student because he had not submitted his tutorial sheets or his expense forms. It meant I was late delivering information to our finance office.  Several days later he emailed me to say that he would be meeting our Head of Dept. on a weekly basis and not dealing with me.  I had no idea what I had done wrong or if I had indeed done something wrong. My boss told me it was nothing to worry about BUT I hadn't to email this student.  It created a lot of fuss and I'll admit it riled me as I had no idea what was going on. At my annual review I felt I had to mention it and it turned out that this male muslim student did not want to deal with me because I wore a cross around my neck. Not that it is relevant but it's a tiny diamond cross that I wear more for sentimental reasons than anything else. Needless to say I was absolutely furious and more with my boss than the student. Why didn't my boss tell this student that what I wore was none of his business? Well, why would he? It was obviously easier to insult and embarrass me.
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Iluvandy
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Re: News Thread « Reply #8414 on: September 20, 2013, 10:42 AM »
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Rolling Eyes

You guys do not get to decide how other people dress because how they dress makes you uncomfortable.

Why not?
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