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Poll
Question: Do you believe in God?
Yes, there is a God - 35 (46.7%)
No (atheist) - 30 (40%)
Unsure (agnostic) - 10 (13.3%)
Total Voters: 74

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Religious Discussions

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Mark
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4890 on: June 01, 2013, 08:47 PM »
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It can be as simple as suddenly getting the urge to send a text to a person and you find out it was exactly what they needed at that moment.
We call that a coincidence, they happen all the time. Especially mild ones like your example.
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Caz
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4891 on: June 01, 2013, 08:48 PM »
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You don't believe so you will scoff, but people do hear God talking to them. Not about killing people- that was a hypothetical question that someone asked me.
For some people it could be called gut instinct of just knowing that you should speak to someone or do something. It can be as simple as suddenly getting the urge to send a text to a person and you find out it was exactly what they needed at that moment.
Other people will say they've heard God speak to them as though he was in the same room, others in dreams. Some can be explained away I suppose. But others you have people feeling a sudden call on their lives and moving halfway round the world out of their comfort zone to build orphanages in India (was speaking to someone who did that last week) 
Yes Hazel and these are 'good' people doing 'good' things, but would these same good people kill innocents on God's say so? I don't think so.
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sidtypical
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4892 on: June 01, 2013, 08:49 PM »
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I suppose using the example/lesson of Abraham and that I trust in the complete justice and love of God- that if I was commanded to do something like that, then I would trust and believe that I would not have to carry it out. However, since I don't believe that God would ever ask that of me then it's hypothetical.

That's a very good argument HB. Putting yourself in Abraham's shoes though, at what point would you stop the action ? Would you wait for god to stop you ? What if he didn't ? What if it wasn't god at all, but some malicious spirit disguised as god ? What if it's just a voice in your head ? From an atheist's point of view, religion is a branch of the occult - which can be used to make people believe, and perhaps do, anything - some good, some bad.

God's test of Abraham is viewed as a test of faith which he passed. I see it as a test of his humanity which he failed miserably.

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Caz
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4893 on: June 01, 2013, 08:56 PM »
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Yes Hazel and these are 'good' people doing 'good' things, but would these same good people kill innocents on God's say so? I don't think so.
I should say too, that I don't think God would ask you to do that either. I'm just saying that some people who 'are' evil and 'want' to do evil things, use God as an excuse!
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4894 on: June 01, 2013, 09:00 PM »
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Oh I just googled Religion Virus and saw there was actually a video of Richard Dawkins talking about it:



ps. I honestly have never seen this before or knew about it. I guess great minds just think alike :P
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Iluvandy
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4895 on: June 01, 2013, 09:11 PM »
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The way I take it is 16% of those with Hindu parents saw sense despite Hindu parents highly indoctrinating their children to the religion (more so than any other religious group in the US apparently) while of those with atheist parents 20% didn't care and become agnostic, 35% stated that they changed their religion when marrying a religious partner and 15% where influenced by religious culture.

You seem to take it as gospel that atheist parents do not indoctrinate their children but religious parents do.   Children mostly learn from their parents by example and brought up in a household where God is not spoken of, or even disparaged, is bound to affect the children.    People make their own choices as they mature and many reject their childhood learning, as quite a few on this forum have indicated.    Indoctrination is not very successful but seems to be a source of irritation to non-religious people.            
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Mark
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4896 on: June 01, 2013, 09:18 PM »
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Oh I just googled Religion Virus and saw there was actually a video of Richard Dawkins talking about it:
I've not seen that video before either. I really like the chain letter analogy Smile
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4897 on: June 01, 2013, 09:22 PM »
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I've not seen that video before either. I really like the chain letter analogy Smile

Good old Richard eh?  I find I agree with a lot of what he says, and he can be very entertaining in his delivery. My problem with Dawkins, though, is that he always seems to be a bit TOO certain. Until we understand absolutely everything about the universe, surely there is cause for some doubt ?
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Mark
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4898 on: June 01, 2013, 09:25 PM »
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Good old Richard eh?  I find I agree with a lot of what he says, and he can be very entertaining in his delivery. My problem with Dawkins, though, is that he always seems to be a bit TOO certain. Until we understand absolutely everything about the universe, surely there is cause for some doubt ?

He does give that impression which is why some see him as arrogant but when he addresses that aspect he tries to play it down. For example, I remember watching a video of a lecture where he talked about how he was technically agnostic due to where he is on the certainty scale. Of course, the point being all sensible atheists are technically agnostic.
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Iluvandy
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4899 on: June 01, 2013, 09:35 PM »
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I've not seen that video before either. I really like the chain letter analogy Smile

It could equally be applied to any belief or non-belief.    Too simplistic,     He talks down to people.
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4900 on: June 01, 2013, 09:38 PM »
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It could equally be applied to any belief or non-belief.   
Not really. As a chain letter will predict a terrible death for you, the fear of hell has to be a big factor in the spread of some religions.
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4901 on: June 01, 2013, 09:49 PM »
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He does give that impression which is why some see him as arrogant but when he addresses that aspect he tries to play it down. For example, I remember watching a video of a lecture where he talked about how he was technically agnostic due to where he is on the certainty scale. Of course, the point being all sensible atheists are technically agnostic.
I agree with that. I call myself an atheist because I don't believe in a 'god' figure as a higher being/creator/benefactor/morality coach etc etc.  I do, however, reserve judgement on the workings of the universe, and our place as part of it. If I was to be accused of having religion, the single question behind it would have to be ' is there a reason for existence?'  Therein I find spirituality.

I should add that, so far, no scientific discovery has undermined my thinking - only reinforced it.
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4902 on: June 01, 2013, 09:54 PM »
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I'm disappointed Dawkins didn't mention the irony of the evolutionary analogy though :X

Good old Richard eh?  I find I agree with a lot of what he says, and he can be very entertaining in his delivery. My problem with Dawkins, though, is that he always seems to be a bit TOO certain. Until we understand absolutely everything about the universe, surely there is cause for some doubt ?
I imagine I'm about on a par with him as far as certainty goes. It's a little hard to get the correct thought across but it's kind of just obvious to me. I can't help thinking that if it was hypothetically possible for me to somehow get 'transported into the mind' of a theist and see things exactly the way they do then come back into my own mind again but retain the knowledge, thoughts, experiences and logical perception of religion that they had -  that my certainty of atheism would not waver in the slightest, regardless of any theistic mindset I could enter. However if the process was reversed and a theist could see things exactly like I do, and retain my logical perception of it in a way that they was able to still understand it in the same way that I do; I think there might be a fair amount of wavering on the counterpart.

So, I don't know, given that statement I just made you made might want to use the word 'arrogant' towards me lol. But to be honest I don't particularly care about religious discussion any more, nowadays I more or less just dismiss it and don't consider it worth talking about but I still get sucked into conversations about it occasionally; old habits die hard and I suppose it's still fun sometimes. Yeah I think I just made myself sound even more arrogant there lol, I better stop speaking.  #digging_a_hole
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Iluvandy
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4903 on: June 01, 2013, 10:00 PM »
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Not really. As a chain letter will predict a terrible death for you, the fear of hell has to be a big factor in the spread of some religions.

As most religions are losing their grip on people now, can we assume people have lost their fear of hell.     I think there's a bit more to religion than simple fear.
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Mark
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Re: Religious Discussions « Reply #4904 on: June 01, 2013, 10:02 PM »
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As most religions are losing their grip on people now, can we assume people have lost their fear of hell.     
I haven't lost my fear of hell and I'm an atheist. That's just me though but I think it's generally very powerful to be brought up with that as a truth.
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