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Dismal Murray falls to Chardy

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teejay1
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #180 on: August 18, 2012, 02:18 PM »
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Hi All,

I did a post last night on my Ipad, which then decided to not connect to the net, so it wouldn't send, so I'll try to remember what points I was going to make.

I'm not sure what the point is of showing how many matches various players have played this year. The first thing I thought when I saw the figures was hang on, Andy couldn't play Madrid because of his back injury. What was he supposed to do, turn up and play on that ridiculous blue clay and risk going over and hurting himself even more? I think not. He isn't stupid.

Some of the others on the list will have played more Davis Cup than Andy this year. The whys and wherefore's of Andy playing Davis Cup are entirely another issue for another thread. However, my own take on it is that Andy's singles career has to take priority. With the best will in the world Great Britain won't be winning the Davis Cup any time soon, and I'm not sure Andy should be expected to prop up the team all the time, however much he enjoys playing for his country.

The other thing to say is that Ferrer and Tipsarevic would both play in tournaments where Andy wouldn't automatically be expected to play. What is he supposed to do, turn up to some God forsaken place to play in a tournament he could win with his eyes closed and his hands behind his back just on principle? Part of being a pro is managing your schedule right, and Andy doesn't do too badly on that score.

The thing that would make those match stats more relevant is win/loss ratio. Andy hasn't lost that many matches this year to people outside the top 3. I know there has been the odd freaky loss, but not that many. Equally, in all the talk about the number of titles Andy has notched up (or not) this year, no one has mentioned the two other finals Andy reached, one in Miami I think, losing to Djokovic, the other in Dubai, where he beat Djokovic in straights in the semi's before losing to Federer in the final. My point is, fine, talk about the doom and gloom aspects, but mention all the positives as well, and there are plenty. Had Andy won those two other finals he would (obviously) now have had four titles this year, and no one would be tearing their hair out.

As I said, there has been the odd freaky loss. The clay season wasn't great this year, but the quarters at Roland Garros wasn't bad. The clay is arguably not Andy's best surface anyway, and I think you have to ask whether last year was an out of the ordinary good year for him on the red stuff. I wouldn't know. However, Andy did also have the back problem. The clay isn't an easy surface when you are not right, and during that part of the year it was clear Andy wasn't right, and I don't care what anyone says to the contrary.

I can't remember where it was (one of you would know) but didn't Andy get to the quarters of one of the Masters tournaments after only playing one round? He had a bye for the first round, which the top 8 do, and he played the second round, winning. His third round opponent pulled out - my instinct tells me it was Raonic or Berdych, I just can't remember - leaving Andy to play the quarters on the basis of one match. It was interesting to hear the split opinion of the commentators. Some said it would have given Andy a break, others said that once you are in a tournament playing is better than practice for keeping momentum. Anyway, Andy lost.

I think it all comes down to Andy's game though. I think you do have to remember that Lendl and Andy have seemed to be taking his game apart this year and working on key areas, which Philip brilliantly explained much better than I could. However, what I do know is that Andy has gone from basically a defensive player, to a player who is brilliant in defence, but will also now attack and take matches to opponents. However, I'm sure that change hasn't come easily. We all know that for a while Andy played cat and mouse with 'easier' opponents, but tried to bring his more aggressive game out for the top three. Now he is consistently more aggressive against all of his opponents, and that way of playing now looks right on him. The thing is though, his game is undoubtedly still a work in progress. He will undoubtedly have off days even now. The trick is to have those off days at the right time. Cincy was the right time. The USO would clearly be the wrong time, not that I anticipate that happening.

I'm not going to reinvent the wheel again, but the implication that Andy isn't or shouldn't be tired is ridiculous. I can't put it any plainer than that without being rude. It isn't just the playing either. It is all the emotional energy. Andy got to his first final at Wimbledon this year in his home country, a country that is desperate beyond words for its first major winner in over 75 years. The pressure of that must have been immense. Everyone wanted a bit of Andy, everyone had an opinion. The man himself probably just wanted to play well and win. Well, he did play well, but he lost. We all know how tough that loss was. I know I wasn't the only one who cried right along with him in early July. However, very quickly Andy had to pull himself together and get ready for the Olympics, and he did. Out he came, back to Wimbledon within three weeks of losing that final. Over the next 9 days that man played doubles, mixed doubles and singles, and played, I have to say it, some of the very best tennis I have ever seen him play, but just as importantly, he put his heart and soul in to it. Andrew Castle was (for once) quite right during the singles final when he described Andy as a man possessed as soon as he put on that GB shirt. He went out there to win, and he did.

When athletes from other disciplines were having a well earned rest what was Andy doing? Oh yes, interviews and media stuff his sport requires under its rules. He had no time to savour or enjoy his win, no time to get his head around the fact that for the first time he had done what certain people said he could not do, arguing that he wasn't tough enough. He had beaten two of the top three to win a big title, because make no mistake about it, it might not have decent ranking points, but that Olympic title is HUGE. Then, when everyone else was enduring....er, I mean enjoying, the closing ceremony, Andy was gearing up to go to Toronto and then Cincy. He arrived in Toronto looking almost asleep on his feet, but still clearly working on adrenalin and elation, but won a round before pulling out - wisely. He got to Cincy and pasted Querrey before clearly hitting a wall against Chardy, who was clearly doing a Rosol - they should adopt that as a new tennis term for a weird win, a Rosol Whistle

The thing is, Andy arguably could have dug deep and turned the match with Chardy around, maybe. He did try. However, really, what would be the point? The ranking points, some would say. Well fine, but Andy has bigger fish to fry than a Masters at this point. Isn't it better for him to keep something back, especially this busy year, for the last major of the year? A strong showing at the USO will give him some points. Then, when the USO is over, he can focus his energies on recouping any points he might still need.

Now, again with the ifs and buts. If Ferrer does this, if Andy doesn't do that, blah, blah, blah. Well, what if Ferrer has peaked this year? Sure, he has done well so far, very well, but what if that is it now? Also, what has he done in the majors in comparison to Andy? What if, and I say it cautiously, Andy wins the USO and then goes on a good run in the rest of the year? What if he again goes on a good run in Asia?  What if he comes over completely silly and wins the WTF? Don't get me wrong, it's fine to look at the worst scene scenarios for Andy, but what about those others nearest to him? Ferrer could be done. Tsonga is a bit up and down. Berdych is away with the faries. As well as the suggestion/possibility (I don't see it happening, but there we are) of Andy going down a bit, he could also move up to three in the world, maybe, just maybe mind, even higher by year end. We will see. All I know is that whatever happens there is no point in going to pieces over any of it yet. I have total confidence that Andy will do whatever he needs to do to get the results he wants.

[ Last edit by teejay1 August 18, 2012, 03:45 PM ] IP Logged
Emma Jean
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #181 on: August 18, 2012, 02:24 PM »
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No you are wrong. I dont know a Federer supporters website for instance. Never visited one, never tried to find one. Ive never recorded a Federer match (unless he's playing Andy. Ive never rushed home from work to watch a Federer match. I watch or record ALL Andy's matches and Ive seen him live a few times.


You are a Federer fan first and foremost. Let me break it down to you and while I do it, I'll pretend as if you didn't know it all this time either.

1. You call yourself BigNose not because you have a big nose but it's just a nickname you have picked up for Federer. It's not to show disrespect but just to hide behind the name and the player you truly support.

2. You are awfully defensive about Federer to the point that you almost never miss a chance to wind Andy fans up to make your point.

3. You are always very quick to highlight and show Andy's shortcomings at every chance you get.

4. Finally, you hate both Nadal and Nole but Nadal especially with all your guts. Coincidence? Not really.

So don't try to sell me what you do in your personal life because I have no way of verifying it nor am I interested. And my above points are based on your posts on this forum. Feel free to deny it though since it will take you some time to be a real man I take it.
[ Last edit by Emma Jean August 18, 2012, 02:52 PM ] IP Logged
Emma Jean
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #182 on: August 18, 2012, 02:50 PM »
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As to Andy's frustration that he showed in the match, I sometimes get the feeling as if some people have just started watching Andy. It's mind boggling at times as to how much they read into it and see it as all or nothing as if that's all there's to it and nothing behind it. As if, all of a sudden, there's either something seriously wrong with Andy overnight or he has just dropped his level overnight. If anyone knows Andy for a while and is familiar with his on court behaviour, then they should know by now that Andy is actually quite notorious for it and that's regardless win or loss. There were a number of times in the past he showed enormous frustration even when he was in a perfectly good position to win the match and he, in fact, went to win the match. This is more common than it's not and this is Andy who used to be like this all this time. I had a friend who was neutral about Andy once told me that she really tried to support Andy, but Andy's negative body language even when he's winning position sort of turned her off. I explained to her that Andy typically does that when he has this perfect shot in his mind but he can't execute it properly and doesn't mind showing it at all and it has nothing to do with the outcome of the match. And this mostly happens when he takes an actual match, a match that he is not so serious about, to practice some of the new techniques he wants to try out. Also, he also gets really frustrated when he makes the same mistakes again and again like all of us, which again has nothing to do with the outcome of the match. And if you pay a bit more attention to him then you will notice that he's mostly together in almost all of his GS matches because he's very serious about those matches and in matches like the ones where he's very sure he's going to win, he doesn't mind showing his frustrations there either as he's too confident about his winning percentage. In order to understand all this, one really needs to notice the pattern and pay real attention and not just some superficial observation.
[ Last edit by Emma Jean August 18, 2012, 02:53 PM ] IP Logged
scotnadian
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #183 on: August 18, 2012, 02:55 PM »
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^So in a nutshell, you still believe he tanked this match?
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jdonald
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #184 on: August 18, 2012, 03:05 PM »
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I think all of you are becoming  obsessed about Andy's points.
 Having lost at Cin he now has 7, 280 points. ferrer has 5,455, Tsonga 4,880 berdacy 4,425 and Del proto 3,305.  if del potor wins this event he will receive 1,000 and then be 4,305. All the others are out of this event.  Murray will be 3rd seed at the uso and he must do well there having got to the semis, I m sure he will.

I think he is very tired ,Fed was wise and did not rush to play Toronto. Andy will be fine, we must all be positive not negative.
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frustationmurrayfan
Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #185 on: August 18, 2012, 03:13 PM »
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This is a forum for excuses and radical explanations about Andy's failures!
Work in progress, will win the golden slam..bha bha bha.,,,,Andy is still  an inconsistent grand slam tennis underachiever.  What a waste of talent!  Hopefully he wins a few grand slams and does not become Great Britain's version of America's Andy Roddick...another disappointment.  Tennis greats are known for winning and not losing!  It's now or never buddy...now start winning please!
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backhandslice
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #186 on: August 18, 2012, 03:36 PM »
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^ hahahahaha  we have another one    FFS.      Fmfan ?!?.  WTF are you talking about.  Jesus.    





Do you know what  I'm getting really fed up with some people on here.  FFS.  Andy is human.    You can't win everything.  he did not TANK the Chardy match.  He simply had a off day and Chardy played well.    End of story.     Andy is still quite capable of winning the US Open imo.
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Emma Jean
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #187 on: August 18, 2012, 03:41 PM »
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No need to react so much, John. It's not a true Andy fan but it can do that because there are some negative Andy fans here, so it gives them a chance to post garbage posing as "Andy/Murray fan" and rile the true fans up. It's trolling. Don't fall for it. It will go away.
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Sabine
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #188 on: August 18, 2012, 03:45 PM »
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This is a forum for excuses and radical explanations about Andy's failures!
Work in progress, will win the golden slam..bha bha bha.,,,,Andy is still  an inconsistent grand slam tennis underachiever.  What a waste of talent!  Hopefully he wins a few grand slams and does not become Great Britain's version of America's Andy Roddick...another disappointment.  Tennis greats are known for winning and not losing!  It's now or never buddy...now start winning please!

Excuse me, Andy Roddick has won a Grand slam and has finished runner up 4 times losing them all to Roger (considered to be the greatest of all time). Roddick is right now inconsistent since he relied a lot on his serve and as you become older it gradually becomes weak....since he had a mighty serve, his footwork was very poor but that is not the case with Andy..He is overall a very balanced player if you ask me in terms of his play...yes, he is also inconsistent but he has got a thing over Roddick and will achieve more than him. By the way, Andy Roddick is a former world number 1,something which Andy has not yet achieved.

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backhandslice
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #189 on: August 18, 2012, 03:46 PM »
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yeah  I know EJ.  I'm just like so pissed   ugh.  that troll Can't even spell Frustration  right.  *  I do facepalm*
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blueberryhill
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #190 on: August 18, 2012, 03:47 PM »
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This is a forum for excuses and radical explanations about Andy's failures!
Work in progress, will win the golden slam..bha bha bha.,,,,Andy is still  an inconsistent grand slam tennis underachiever.  What a waste of talent!  Hopefully he wins a few grand slams and does not become Great Britain's version of America's Andy Roddick...another disappointment.  Tennis greats are known for winning and not losing!  It's now or never buddy...now start winning please!



9-8 and counting
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Sabine
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #191 on: August 18, 2012, 03:47 PM »
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Can everyone stop being so critical???????
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michelle
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #192 on: August 18, 2012, 04:21 PM »
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This is a forum for excuses and radical explanations about Andy's failures!
Work in progress, will win the golden slam..bha bha bha.,,,,Andy is still  an inconsistent grand slam tennis underachiever.  What a waste of talent!  Hopefully he wins a few grand slams and does not become Great Britain's version of America's Andy Roddick...another disappointment.  Tennis greats are known for winning and not losing!  It's now or never buddy...now start winning please!
Well don't come on it then. We certainly don't need you here.
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #193 on: August 18, 2012, 05:06 PM »
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@Philip. 1.11am. At last, the voice of reason clap
 thumb up
bbh you took the very words out of my mouth.  At last some sanity Philip.  I was getting more and more down reading my way through the posts so such a relief to come to yours.
And J. Jackson @12.56pm who, like others, I assume was responding to the match report:  I rest my original case about the report  Whistle  ie what kind of message does it send to visitors to this site?  J Jackson has given us one clear answer.
As to Andy's demeanour on court I still feel he looked flat and that there was something up which his team already knew about.  That's not necessarily inconsistent with him being disgusted with his performance and I certainly don't believe he tanked it.  But it's just possible that unconsciously he wasn't as committed to the match as he usually is because of whatever it is that was troubling him. And yes it could be mental tiredness.  Tiredness responds not just to the quantitative but to the qualitative ie you can't just count up number of matches played but as someone has said the conditions under which they are played and also the expectations Andy had to deal with during the grasscourt season could have been mentally draining.
[ Last edit by Ruthie August 18, 2012, 05:17 PM ] IP Logged
janetx
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Re: Dismal Murray falls to Chardy « Reply #194 on: August 18, 2012, 05:36 PM »
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9-8 and counting

 Good posting!

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