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Murray dismisses sports psychology

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kel3350
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #45 on: December 07, 2011, 02:46 PM »
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Cheers, Allan.
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #46 on: December 07, 2011, 03:51 PM »
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"What would I have needed to see to prove the forth will be any different?? Ooh, let me think - a SET or TWO perhaps!! Did you watch his three Slam finals? How did he improue from one to the next? Please tell me..."

No, he didn't improve, if anything he was worse. However you don't get to number 8 in the all time versus top tenners, top 10 of all time 5 set records or win 8 out of 9 masters finals by being terminally lilly livered!
He probably will need someone other than the top 3 for his first slam in the final (which is what they benefitted from too)so as I said he needs a bit of luck. Or, the penny could drop he may have had enough of situation and decide to dig deeper & well act like a grown man.
I don't include his first final (although he wouldnt have won that one either) but i do think his performances in the last 2 were terrrible. But he played brilliant tennis to get there so its just the final piece of the puzzle.
He will get used to the situation eventually even if it takes another 3 finals to get there, once the first slam is out of the way I believe the problem is out of the way for good. Is it too much to expect Murray to grow as a player and human being when thats what he has done so well in just the last 6 months?
I don't think so myself, & its certainly not too much to expect him now to get to more slam finals as that he has proven he can at least do.
His progression has been has been very slow but also inexorable and once he has turned a corner there has been no going back.
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michelle
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #47 on: December 07, 2011, 04:19 PM »
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"What would I have needed to see to prove the forth will be any different?? Ooh, let me think - a SET or TWO perhaps!! Did you watch his three Slam finals? How did he improue from one to the next? Please tell me..."

No, he didn't improve, if anything he was worse. However you don't get to number 8 in the all time versus top tenners, top 10 of all time 5 set records or win 8 out of 9 masters finals by being terminally lilly livered!
He probably will need someone other than the top 3 for his first slam in the final (which is what they benefitted from too)so as I said he needs a bit of luck. Or, the penny could drop he may have had enough of situation and decide to dig deeper & well act like a grown man.
I don't include his first final (although he wouldnt have won that one either) but i do think his performances in the last 2 were terrrible. But he played brilliant tennis to get there so its just the final piece of the puzzle.
He will get used to the situation eventually even if it takes another 3 finals to get there, once the first slam is out of the way I believe the problem is out of the way for good. Is it too much to expect Murray to grow as a player and human being when thats what he has done so well in just the last 6 months?
I don't think so myself, & its certainly not too much to expect him now to get to more slam finals as that he has proven he can at least do.
His progression has been has been very slow but also inexorable and once he has turned a corner there has been no going back.
I agree with you, Andy needs a bit of luck, as the other three did, and as I've said before He will a GS this year, I'm hoping the Aussie will be the first and that will set him up for the others. You only have to watch the way he destroyed Rafa in Tokyo, he can beat Federer and Nole as we have seen. He knows the pressure of a GS final and will I am sure be able to deal with it this time. He needs us to believe in him and to assure him that we are behind him. Nadal, Nole and Fed seem to have their fans behind them and they know it, this has helped them,
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Emma Jean
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #48 on: December 07, 2011, 05:25 PM »
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This news doesn't surprise me. I believe Andy's too proud to go down the sports psycologist route. How is he going to overcome his demons without outside help, though? Will he win a Slam? It pains me to say but I'll believe it when I see it.

Andy is like your man's man. He loves to solve his own problems if there's one. Judging by his comments, it seems he is in denial. In that long interview of his not so long ago, he said there’s no pressure and that sometimes you are just not good enough. Right and makes sense to a certain point too, but this still doesn't explain why he would lose all three finals in the same fashion to the very players he regularly beats outside slam on a regular basis. So how he is not good enough in a slam final is beyond me. Andy, care to explain?

As I see it, all those finals were played on hard courts and he has a number of hard court titles, in fact, majority of them beating the likes of Federer, Novak, Nadal etc. So if he says he’s not good enough then clearly he is in denial. This is just to avoid any kind of therapy IMO. He feels very close and I guess he does but these are such baby steps. Tennis is not a lifelong sport. I guess he doesn't want the headlines to go like, "With the help of Sport Therapy, Andy Murray was finally able to win a Slam". And it will read this way. Novak's egg and the gluten free diet had made enormous amount of news just this year. And given Andy's nationality and the crazy media that follows, it will definitely create more controversies than ever – not to mention how it will take away all the hard work he has put it so far. People will be quick to say how he should have taken the advice much before and how we all knew it but him etc. I think it's a double edged sword now for him and he's basically a sitting duck. It's too late. He'll do it...he'll solve that problem of his, but it will just take some unknown amount of time. Any problem that is taken care of by self only is going to it take its time. You have all those emotional blocks/steps to go through after all. In any case, I don’t see any quick results either way, frankly.
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Emma Jean
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #49 on: December 07, 2011, 05:34 PM »
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Speaking of luck - yes, he indeed need a ton of it. He needs a very good draw and a perfect schedule. Everyone got a break at their first slam shot - even Federer - so it's only fair he gets one too. There will be absolutely no shame in it. If he faces someone in the final who is also looking for his first grand slam, then Andy has a greater chance, though it will be a choke fest between the two, but Andy is a far better player then the rest and should come through in the end. The five set format will help him get through given ups and downs which he will most certainly face. Given everything - fresh and rested, suface, conditions, schedules, distance - AO is the most ideal Slam for Andy.  All he needs is a very favourable draw and that's all. AO is unpredictable in this way anyway.
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #50 on: December 07, 2011, 06:25 PM »
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Even Federer?
His first 8 or 9 slams had good fortune slapped all over him as they were won during a painfully weak era!
I agree, the slower HC courts of the AO are his best shot, & the results show it but I wouldn't discount the US Open or even Wimbledon either.
Andy appears to need to think & feel things through to the last letter before he's secure. Instinctive reactions are generally not his way or aggression, he needs to be aware, but these basic approaches give quicker more direct outcomes. Still I would be more worried about Andy's chances if i thought his game was declining, on the contrary, its just building & building & building (very tantalisingly) every 6 months, and he is clearly a much better player than he was even 6 months ago (certainly more solid in the serve dept with better more offensive groundstrokes). Its coming together, but he will still require a leap of faith come crunch time & to trust himself fully when he takes that leap..
And this is the final breakthrough he has yet to make at the highest stage.
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #51 on: December 07, 2011, 06:55 PM »
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Another thing about the interview I believe you referred to Emma, and the whole business of denial. He said that losing his temper on court & the dramatics was not the main problem, or even top 4, and he drew the comparison of Wayne Rooney being a great player that loses his temper and so on to support his position. Sorry Andy but that is bull, it is a problem if you lose it on the field regardless of your sport as it breaks your concentration. Its a problem for Rooney too, but he has the good fortune of supportive team mates that can share the burden and take some of the pressure. Tennis players have no such luxury and must find a way to be relentlessly positive regardless of the pressure. That's maturity also, but he has recently at least shown improvements in this dept.
But will they be enough to herald a slam to his trophy cabinet?
I don't know.
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kel3350
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #52 on: December 07, 2011, 08:48 PM »
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I agree with you, Andy needs a bit of luck, as the other three did, and as I've said before He will a GS this year, I'm hoping the Aussie will be the first and that will set him up for the others. You only have to watch the way he destroyed Rafa in Tokyo, he can beat Federer and Nole as we have seen. He knows the pressure of a GS final and will I am sure be able to deal with it this time. He needs us to believe in him and to assure him that we are behind him. Nadal, Nole and Fed seem to have their fans behind them and they know it, this has helped them,
You're ''sure'' Andy will cope with the pressure and win a Slam in 2012 despite ALL evidence pointing to the contrary??? Hahahaha!! Please stop it, you're cracking me up! And as for needing his fans to ''assure'' him and ''help'' him... I can't take you seriously.   
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #53 on: December 07, 2011, 09:33 PM »
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All of the evidence you are pointing is really 3 slam finals.
My point is the past doesn't always mirror the future and usually doesn't forever.
If he makes the necessary changes to his game which he is clearly doing in becoming more offensive and with a higher service % he's going to do better
And put himself in position to win
I'm going to have faith in him to find a way to solve this problem as experience shall unavoidably assist him with this.
But ofcourse there's no garuntees that he'll make it.
But honestly even I would stop being nervous after getting to a slam final enough times!
It's human nature.
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #54 on: December 07, 2011, 09:35 PM »
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I should also say that I find Murrays tentativeness infuriating but there has been a clear improvement over the last 2 years in this respect.
Let's hope it continues and he sees the light.
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syc23
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #55 on: December 07, 2011, 11:25 PM »
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I think Andy's first slam will be on the red clay. Surprising but I think there's less expectation in Paris plus he has made massive progress during the clay court swing in 2011 pushing Rafa and Novak better than most players on the tour. That said, if he wins his maiden slam in Australia, then the floodgates will truly open up.
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Iluvandy
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #56 on: December 07, 2011, 11:33 PM »
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I'd prefer Australian followed by Paris!!!!   However which one or how many is all up to Andy - and his team - and it will be done his way.    He knows how as well as what he wants to win - he supports Arsenal because of their style of play and I think style is important to him.    He'll fight himself and win through - any other way
and he wouldn't be Andy.
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kel3350
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #57 on: December 07, 2011, 11:46 PM »
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All of the evidence you are pointing is really 3 slam finals.
My point is the past doesn't always mirror the future and usually doesn't forever.
If he makes the necessary changes to his game which he is clearly doing in becoming more offensive and with a higher service % he's going to do better
And put himself in position to win
I'm going to have faith in him to find a way to solve this problem as experience shall unavoidably assist him with this.
But ofcourse there's no garuntees that he'll make it.
But honestly even I would stop being nervous after getting to a slam final enough times!
It's human nature.
Necessary changes to his game??? Andy has the tools to beat anyone on hard courts but he's been found wanting WHEN IT REALLY MATTERED. It isn't his game, fitness or fans (LOL) that's holding him back, it's his nerves.
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #58 on: December 07, 2011, 11:58 PM »
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Yes yes yes it's been his nerves so far,
But I personally think he's only recently been playing well enough consistently (ie in depth of forehand ground strokes serve % and general
On court demeanour) to be a serious candidate for slam success despite the hype.
He's a very young 24 as far as tennis players go.
Playing better means more confidence means less nerves etc,
They are not exclusive to each other.
Confidence is the real key to his future success.
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michelle
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Re: Murray dismisses sports psychology « Reply #59 on: December 08, 2011, 08:07 AM »
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You're ''sure'' Andy will cope with the pressure and win a Slam in 2012 despite ALL evidence pointing to the contrary??? Hahahaha!! Please stop it, you're cracking me up! And as for needing his fans to ''assure'' him and ''help'' him... I can't take you seriously.   
You are the sort of so called fan I think needs to move to another forum where you obviously belong as you are the follower of another player. Nor do I take kindly to your remarks, you should be aware that if you feel no one believes in you then the outcome is failure. I'm so ashamed to think that you come from Wales, just hope and pray you are not Welsh as I am.
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