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Murray vanquished by history

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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #60 on: July 09, 2012, 07:49 AM »
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Hi! wave  Welcome to MW and thanks for your positive post.  And thank you Phil too for your very good report.

Well I think just about all that can be said about this match has been said.  Would it have made much difference had the roof not been closed?  I don't know.  Certainly Federer seemed to take on a new lease of life but I feel that Andy didn't have too much left in the tank mentally and emotionally after his semifinal win - which was a major achievement in itself and one which also moved Andy to the verge of tears, so we know how much it meant to him.  I think winning the final was just one step too far here, which isn't surprising given the pressure and expectations that were heaped on his shoulders after that win, and also the fact that he was playing one of the greatest players of the modern era.

I'm very, very proud of what Andy has achieved in this tournament, especially given the pretty tough draw he had.  Also he didn't go out with a whimper against Federer but kept battling on until the very end.  He'll feel gutted for a day or so, which is a normal reaction, but his whole mental attitude has changed now.  In the BBC Sport report Andy says -

"It's hard, it's tough to take, but you need to show strength of character to come back from it ... We're talking about one of the greatest athletes of all time. You've got to put it in context a little bit."

Yes, Andy, you have that strength of character, you have a great team behind you and you have a legion of loyal fans plus the many more you won over yesterday.  You will come back, hopefully stronger than before.
Aileen I completely agree with everything you said in the above post. Moreover, I thought I was a person who did not cry easily but I have to admit during Andy's runner up speech the tears just would not stop. We have all witnessed the birth of a future champion. Lendl has been inspirational. Its like he is the missing piece of the jigsaw  puzzle as far Andy and his team are concerned.

After our Andy's loss I read an interesting article about Lendl. Just like our Andy, Lendl's fourth grandslam final loss was at wimbledon.  Directly ater that loss later on that same year lendl went on to win the US Open. I believe Andy will do the same. As one of my colleagues aptly said Murray V2.0 is in production and will roll of the assembly line shortly. This tough loss once processed will spur Andy on to greater heights. The other players in locker room will have taken note of his coming of age this wimbledon. 
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lgriev10
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #61 on: July 09, 2012, 09:08 AM »
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Draw didn't help.
Roof didn't help.
First serve didn't help sometimes.
But looked at home in a grand slam final for the first time.
Played his heart out
Draw didn't help.
Roof didn't help.
First serve didn't help sometimes.
But looked at home in a grand slam final for the first time.
Played his heart out.
Played brilliantly first two sets, had Fed pinned down till he blinked.
Made us proud and sad and hopeful and proud. tender

Played brilliantly first two sets, had Fed pinned down till he blinked.
Made us proud and sad and hopeful and proud. tender

I agree, despite everything, Andy came to the final with a game plan and played well.  I think the roof closing was also significant, because when Federer came back out he changed his game in two ways.

1)  He decided to leap up and hammer all Andy's 2nd  serve, mostly by running round to take them on his forehand, in a way that he couldn't or hadn't thought of in the opening two sets.

2)  He totally put his foot down when it came to the rapid switch from back hand rallies to the banging forehand down the line - his length and precision were peerless.  This payed dividends with the roof being closed and the slippier conditions.  Good coaching, I think. 

Whatever, one has to admire both players!
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KitKat
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #62 on: July 09, 2012, 09:44 AM »
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I cried like a baby, especially when they showed Kim crying as well, I really hope he can pull himself together in time for the Olympics, he would have won a silver medal if this was the Olympics match, hopefully he can go one better though and get the Gold, c'mon Andy, we love you, onwards and upwards.  clap
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Ruthie
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #63 on: July 09, 2012, 10:46 AM »
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Lovely piece by kevin mitchell in today's Guardian but I'm afraid I don't have time to post a link . There was also a quote from Lindsay Davenport saying she watched with Martina Hingis and they were both crying - heartwrenching they called it.
I think Andy has not only won round much of the stupid British public [and on 5 live last night one woman apologised for having been so silly as to get Andy all wrong] but will have won himself many more fans globally.  While this is no consolation to him right now it could well make a difference in some future gs final when he steps out on court.  
I'm still feeling very emotional about it all but don't have that sense of bleak numbness I had after the last 2 gs final losses.

Have just checked out bbc website and found Andy's latest column -he sounds to be dealing with it well. And I'm very glad he's going to take a week's break in the sun somewhere with Kim and possibly the dogs.  http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/tennis/18766101
Also worth reading the blog by bbc's chief sports writer but prepare for the usual sick bags with reference to eulogising of smugfed
[ Last edit by Ruthie July 09, 2012, 12:03 PM ] IP Logged
Lorna Buckle
Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #64 on: July 09, 2012, 12:17 PM »
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Andy proved yesterday that the transformation in his actions on the court maybe brought about by Ivan Lendl have done wonders for his game. He was challenging and up for it, next time Andy you will do it, we were shouting for you.
L yay
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #65 on: July 09, 2012, 12:39 PM »
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He may. He's good enough - but is unlucky to be playing in an era where three of the games greats are at their peak.

Is Rafa at his peak?
Is this year anything like his '10 or 8'. I would say not.
Yes Roger just won Wimbledon but I've a feeling it might be his last hurrah.
Novak is certainly at his peak but is clearly off the boil.
I'm sorry but very little of what you say here is very logical.
Being endlessly pessimistic is not the same as being realistic.
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #66 on: July 09, 2012, 02:33 PM »
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theycanbillme, I agree. And if u r "endlessly pessimistic" surely at some point u must say, "what the heck, if he doesn't win a slam I'll still support him because I  appreciate the way he plays"  Otherwise what's the point?
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #67 on: July 09, 2012, 02:35 PM »
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theycanbillme, I agree. And if u r "endlessly pessimistic" surely at some point u must say, "what the heck, if he doesn't win a slam I'll still support him because I  appreciate the way he plays"  Otherwise what's the point?
As Jamie said, he's a champion whatever.
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #68 on: July 09, 2012, 02:37 PM »
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Is Rafa at his peak?
Is this year anything like his '10 or 8'. I would say not.
Yes Roger just won Wimbledon but I've a feeling it might be his last hurrah.
Novak is certainly at his peak but is clearly off the boil.
I'm sorry but very little of what you say here is very logical.
Being endlessly pessimistic is not the same as being realistic.

In the recent past? Undeniably all three have been at their peak. Even if we accept your stupid and flawed premise, Djokovic - who you say is "clearly off the boil" - won the Australian Open and, for a time, looked likely to beat Rafa at Roland Garros. That same Spaniard reached the final at the Australian Open and only lost because of a miscued backhand passing shot. Federer has indeed been a level below his absolute best, but still managed to blow Murray away over five sets.

So, yeah, Murray is unlucky to be playing in an ear when three of the best players of all time have been playing at their peak. They may now start to decline, but it's equally likely that Murray himself declines.
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #69 on: July 09, 2012, 03:11 PM »
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In the recent past? Undeniably all three have been at their peak. Even if we accept your stupid and flawed premise, Djokovic - who you say is "clearly off the boil" - won the Australian Open and, for a time, looked likely to beat Rafa at Roland Garros. That same Spaniard reached the final at the Australian Open and only lost because of a miscued backhand passing shot. Federer has indeed been a level below his absolute best, but still managed to blow Murray away over five sets.

So, yeah, Murray is unlucky to be playing in an ear when three of the best players of all time have been playing at their peak. They may now start to decline, but it's equally likely that Murray himself declines.

It didn't look like Novak was going to beat Nadal to me, for how long was that then?. He has just been turfed out of the Wimbledon semis by Roger and I predict will have issues holding on to the US Open. Its not stupid to suggest that he is off the boil when he can't hang on to most of what he had the year before. Its not an easy thing to do & he has proved that. I'm sure he will be back however.
And for gods sake It is not equally likely that Murray shall start declining with Federer and Rafa either. Both of whom have been on the tour for over a decade with hundreds of more matches under their belts than Andy, in Roger's case more than double. To suggest that he would sounds pretty stupid to me, & ridiculous.
[ Last edit by theycanbillme July 09, 2012, 03:19 PM ] IP Logged
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #70 on: July 09, 2012, 03:24 PM »
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Nadal is probably on the downside of his peak. He hasn't won any title outside clay since 2010 but that also has a lot to do with the other three as well. Federer too is on the downside as he really needs to rely on the off chance most time to win a title these days. Nole is definitely at this peak though this year he’s laying slightly low. Andy's prime I believe will start next year. I don't think we have seen his total best yet. He's a late bloomer because 0f many things he has going on which involves the top 3 as well. He needed time to finally come together and be more mature about things. Both Nadal and Federer, Nadal especially, peaked rather early.
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #71 on: July 09, 2012, 03:25 PM »
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Agree with all you have said TCB, imo over the next couple of years it is going to be Djokovic/Murray will be the new Federer/Nadal era.
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #72 on: July 09, 2012, 03:35 PM »
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The Rafa of 10' would have found a way to deal with Rosol.
Even if it meant taking as many MTO as he could, to me that was a warning sign and as EJ has said he hasn't won anything out of clay since 10'. I think it will be highly unlikely that he'll dominate out of clay going on and Novak will get closer and closer on the clay again not just in masters but at RG. He may only be 26 but he's been on the tour since he was 15.
This most recent pull out is indicative that even Nadals powers of regenration have a shelf life, i expect we are at the beginning of the end there, and when it comes it will be a lot swifter than Roger's.
As for Roger, the stars aligned and he took his chances like the champ he is. That is all.
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theycanbillme
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #73 on: July 09, 2012, 03:41 PM »
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theycanbillme, I agree. And if u r "endlessly pessimistic" surely at some point u must say, "what the heck, if he doesn't win a slam I'll still support him because I  appreciate the way he plays" Otherwise what's the point?

You are correct, there is no point in being endlessly pessimistic. Its obviously more of a psychological problem than a rational position to take.
[ Last edit by theycanbillme July 09, 2012, 03:57 PM ] IP Logged
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Re: Murray vanquished by history « Reply #74 on: July 09, 2012, 03:46 PM »
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I actually think Andy has played the best tennis of his career.. right here.  at this moment.  I believe he will get something at the Olympics  and win the US  Open.  Its only fair
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