MurraysWorld  >  Playground  >  Read-the-Round  >  Should we just scrap RTR?
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Should we just scrap RTR?

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Although this isn't the case right now, my preference for RTR has always been to allow everyone to organise it spontaneously among themselves rather than have official organisers. That way you'll probably always have a couple of people at one period of time who are interested in it and therefore take the initiative.
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@Mark
The scoring is way too complicated and too much to ask of one person.
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Although this isn't the case right now, my preference for RTR has always been to allow everyone to organise it spontaneously among themselves rather than have official organisers. That way you'll probably always have a couple of people at one period of time who are interested in it and therefore take the initiative.
I agree with blueberryhill, and also I feel that leaving RTR to be done as you suggest is too haphazard, something which could lead to the RTR for a particular match being done too near the deadline and so people missing out on it.
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Its been over a year since we last discussed this.

Would anyone be willing to join a team to revive this?
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no
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Although this isn't the case right now, my preference for RTR has always been to allow everyone to organise it spontaneously among themselves rather than have official organisers. That way you'll probably always have a couple of people at one period of time who are interested in it and therefore take the initiative.
Having a team finally fell apart, so what about taking up Mark's idea?  Sounds good to me, although I see I've changed my mind about this. lol  Surely it would help though if people could predict once the first match has started?

Also BBH mentioned the complicated scoring, with which I agree, so is there a way this could be done more simply?
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Having a team finally fell apart, so what about taking up Mark's idea?  Sounds good to me, although I see I've changed my mind about this. lol  Surely it would help though if people could predict once the first match has started?

Also BBH mentioned the complicated scoring, with which I agree, so is there a way this could be done more simply?

I've been looking at some of the forums on the rules and how the game used to be played, and I will happily organise it as I think it will be fun to revive it- as long as there is enough support from other members who will play. I will also think of ways to make the scoring less complicated and make it easier to play.
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The more it can be simplified the better.
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I've been looking at some of the forums on the rules and how the game used to be played, and I will happily organise it as I think it will be fun to revive it- as long as there is enough support from other members who will play. I will also think of ways to make the scoring less complicated and make it easier to play.
Thank you Matthew because I really do think it should be revived, especially as I feel there will be a good amount of interest in it.
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The more it can be simplified the better.

In what ways was the scoring too complicated?
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Ok maybe it's not wise for me to comment in RTR again but I will go against better judgement and make some suggestions lol. ok here it goes:

1) Do individual champions JUST for each tournament and not an overall year winner. This way nobody will need to keep track of scores and it will not matter if you miss a tournament in the year (as how it was missing a couple of tournaments could put you out of contention for winning in the year).

2) Consider perhaps ONLY doing grand-slam tournaments, this way you are only doing RTR 4 times a year and people won't get fatigued or bored with it.

3) Only award points for an exact match in sets and the winner (say 10 points). This will make scoring a lot easier.

4) Let people make a prediction about ANY 4 matches on the day. The thread starter can then simply copy/paste the list of every match into the post from a score site (like flashscore.com) or something. The list of matches for the next day is normally posted on those sites for the next day so the thread starter can post a thread the day before. This method has several benefits:

- Firstly it is much easier and quicker for a thread starter since they can simply copy and paste the list very quickly and do not need to make any decisions on which matches to pick. It might then be simple enough to allow anybody to start a match thread?

-Secondly it will make things more interesting as people can make predictions about different matches and the ones they are interested in.

- Thirdly, and I think this is a big benefit: If people come late to the thread and miss the start of some matches there will still be plenty of other matches they could choose to make predictions for which are on later in the day. Or again if somebody withdraws due to injury that match could be nullified and they could get the chance the make a prediction on another later match (the only caveat is if an injury occurs in the last match of the day?).

Of course when it gets the the SF and final you would only then do 2 and 1 matches . Maybe you could up the scores so a match is worth 15 for the SF and 20 for the final to make the end of the tournament a bit more exciting? It will still be easy to score.

5) Consider getting people to post their own scores in the match day thread, so they have to check themselves what they got right. This way the emphasis is purely on the players so it will be their own fault if they miss out their score, and it will be a heck of a lot less work for the organizers. I'm sure most people here are trustworthy enough to do their own scoring and if anybody is doing it wrong or cheating I'm sure someone will eventually realize. Or perhaps do a mixed system where people should be responsible for posting their own score in the match day thread but if somebody wanted they could voluntarily go through the thread and post everybody's scores as well.

Then really an organizer (or any member really) could add up a tally of the scores just at the end of the tournament or perhaps just before the final so people know what the scores are going into the final. If all the scores are posted in the threads it should take that long for somebody to go through the days and put them in an excel spreadsheet.
[ Last edit by laundry May 27, 2015, 07:33 PM ] IP Logged
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Ok maybe it's not wise for me to comment in RTR again but I will go against better judgement and make some suggestions lol. ok here it goes:

1) Do individual champions JUST for each tournament and not an overall year winner. This way nobody will need to keep track of scores and it will not matter if you miss a tournament in the year (as how it was missing a couple of tournaments could put you out of contention for winning in the year).

2) Consider perhaps ONLY doing grand-slam tournaments, this way you are only doing RTR 4 times a year and people won't get fatigued or bored with it.

3) Only award points for an exact match in sets and the winner (say 10 points). This will make scoring a lot easier.

4) Let people make a prediction about ANY 4 matches on the day. The thread starter can then simply copy/paste the list of every match into the post from a score site (like flashscore.com) or something. The list of matches for the next day is normally posted on those sites for the next day so the thread starter can post a thread the day before. This method has several benefits:

- Firstly it is much easier and quicker for a thread starter since they can simply copy and paste the list very quickly and do not need to make any decisions on which matches to pick. It might then be simple enough to allow anybody to start a match thread?

-Secondly it will make things more interesting as people can make predictions about different matches and the ones they are interested in.

- Thirdly, and I think this is a big benefit: If people come late to the thread and miss the start of some matches there will still be plenty of other matches they could choose to make predictions for which are on later in the day. Or again if somebody withdraws due to injury that match could be nullified and they could get the chance the make a prediction on another later match (the only caveat is if an injury occurs in the last match of the day?).

Of course when it gets the the SF and final you would only then do 2 and 1 matches . Maybe you could up the scores so a match is worth 15 for the SF and 20 for the final to make the end of the tournament a bit more exciting? It will still be easy to score.

5) Consider getting people to post their own scores in the match day thread, so they have to check themselves what they got right. This way the emphasis is purely on the players so it will be their own fault if they miss out their score, and it will be a heck of a lot less work for the organizers. I'm sure most people here are trustworthy enough to do their own scoring and if anybody is doing it wrong or cheating I'm sure someone will eventually realize. Or perhaps do a mixed system where people should be responsible for posting their own score in the match day thread but if somebody wanted they could voluntarily go through the thread and post everybody's scores as well.

Then really an organizer (or any member really) could add up a tally of the scores just at the end of the tournament or perhaps just before the final so people know what the scores are going into the final. If all the scores are posted in the threads it should take that long for somebody to go through the days and put them in an excel spreadsheet.

Ok first of all thanks for your post!

1. I agree with your 1st point and that we should have a champion for each tournament. But I think just for fun it will interesting to keep a ranking to see who performs best over a year- I will happily keep tally of the rankings as it will be no trouble.

2. I agree that too many tournaments will create fatigue among players. But I think that only having the 4 slams will not be enough as there will be long periods when people forget about the game and so it may be harder to get people back playing when the next slam comes around. Therefore I think playing Slams, WTF, Masters and maybe a couple of 500s will be sufficient- I will happily manage the majority of tournaments with a little bit of help for some of them.

3. Sometimes the amount of sets in a match can be very unpredictable and so I think the previous system of scoring 1 point for a winner and 3 for the correct amount of sets will work well, I do not think scoring that would be too difficult.

4. I would say that a max 8 matches could be put on any single day OOP. The problem with letting people score whatever match they liked would mean that everyone would pick the obvious match to predict- for example for today they would pick Federer in 3 and tomorrow Djokovic in 3. This would lose the difficulty and interest in trying to predict 50/50 match-ups. I think allowing people to predict matches up to the start of each match is a good idea and so the OOP should always have a few later matches in it so people will still see a point in posting their picks.

I think having extra points available for the later rounds would definitely create more excitement and is a very good idea.

5. That is a good idea and would  make life much easier for a organiser, and maybe when they have some spare time they can check that everyone added up their scores right if they wanted to.
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Ok maybe it's not wise for me to comment in RTR again but I will go against better judgement and make some suggestions lol. ok here it goes:

1) Do individual champions JUST for each tournament and not an overall year winner. This way nobody will need to keep track of scores and it will not matter if you miss a tournament in the year (as how it was missing a couple of tournaments could put you out of contention for winning in the year).

2) Consider perhaps ONLY doing grand-slam tournaments, this way you are only doing RTR 4 times a year and people won't get fatigued or bored with it.

3) Only award points for an exact match in sets and the winner (say 10 points). This will make scoring a lot easier.

4) Let people make a prediction about ANY 4 matches on the day. The thread starter can then simply copy/paste the list of every match into the post from a score site (like flashscore.com) or something. The list of matches for the next day is normally posted on those sites for the next day so the thread starter can post a thread the day before. This method has several benefits:

- Firstly it is much easier and quicker for a thread starter since they can simply copy and paste the list very quickly and do not need to make any decisions on which matches to pick. It might then be simple enough to allow anybody to start a match thread?

-Secondly it will make things more interesting as people can make predictions about different matches and the ones they are interested in.

- Thirdly, and I think this is a big benefit: If people come late to the thread and miss the start of some matches there will still be plenty of other matches they could choose to make predictions for which are on later in the day. Or again if somebody withdraws due to injury that match could be nullified and they could get the chance the make a prediction on another later match (the only caveat is if an injury occurs in the last match of the day?).

Of course when it gets the the SF and final you would only then do 2 and 1 matches . Maybe you could up the scores so a match is worth 15 for the SF and 20 for the final to make the end of the tournament a bit more exciting? It will still be easy to score.

5) Consider getting people to post their own scores in the match day thread, so they have to check themselves what they got right. This way the emphasis is purely on the players so it will be their own fault if they miss out their score, and it will be a heck of a lot less work for the organizers. I'm sure most people here are trustworthy enough to do their own scoring and if anybody is doing it wrong or cheating I'm sure someone will eventually realize. Or perhaps do a mixed system where people should be responsible for posting their own score in the match day thread but if somebody wanted they could voluntarily go through the thread and post everybody's scores as well.

Then really an organizer (or any member really) could add up a tally of the scores just at the end of the tournament or perhaps just before the final so people know what the scores are going into the final. If all the scores are posted in the threads it should take that long for somebody to go through the days and put them in an excel spreadsheet.

Help me out with it mate. I agree with all your points.
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Nothing to help with really. Just need to confirm the rules (I guess with Mark and some of the members looking to play). Then Mark could open the forum up so anybody can start threads. Then just give it a go at Wimbledon 2015? Maybe give a quick PM round all the members that used to play to let them know what's happening.

Starting a thread is very easy with my proposed rules. If people use flashscore mobile site, can simply copy/paste the entire draw for the next day from this link: http://www.flashscore.mobi/tennis/?d=1

And an example would look like so:

11:00 Nishikori K. (Jpn) WO - Becker B. (Ger) -:-
11:00 Rosol L. (Cze) - Gabashvili T. (Rus) -:-
12:30 Dzumhur D. (Bih) - Federer R. (Sui) -:-
12:30 Mahut N. (Fra) - Simon G. (Fra) -:-
14:00 Wawrinka S. (Sui) - Johnson S. (Usa) -:-
14:30 Monfils G. (Fra) - Cuevas P. (Uru) -:-
16:00 Paire B. (Fra) - Berdych T. (Cze) -:-
16:00 Tsonga J-W. (Fra) - Andujar-Alba P. (Esp) -:-

Predict 4 of the above matches and remember your banker!
Please post your own scores for the day in this thread after your matches have finished. You get 10 points for every exact score you predicted or 20 points if you used your banker for that match!

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Well I had to put a strike-though the Nish match as he had a WO and a went down the matches putting a space after the times as there wasn't one; just need to do space, down, space, down, space, etc to do that all very quick and easy anyway.
[ Last edit by laundry May 28, 2015, 07:04 PM ] IP Logged
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Just to reply to some of Matthew's points.

1. I agree with your 1st point and that we should have a champion for each tournament. But I think just for fun it will interesting to keep a ranking to see who performs best over a year- I will happily keep tally of the rankings as it will be no trouble.
It would be fine to do that if you wanted yourself for fun. However I think the emphasis for winning should be placed primarily on each individual tournament instead of year rankings as this for me ruined the game before and made it far too long and too much commitment.

2. I agree that too many tournaments will create fatigue among players. But I think that only having the 4 slams will not be enough as there will be long periods when people forget about the game and so it may be harder to get people back playing when the next slam comes around. Therefore I think playing Slams, WTF, Masters and maybe a couple of 500s will be sufficient- I will happily manage the majority of tournaments with a little bit of help for some of them.
I guess it would be down to demand, if emphasis is put on it being the winner of the tournaments and not the year as a whole then there is no reason somebody couldn't spring up a new thread for a masters or something if they wanted. It would be somewhat useful if the tournaments could somehow be separated or archived once they are completed so the forum isn't a complete mess with a mix of threads? That would be up to Mark though.

3. Sometimes the amount of sets in a match can be very unpredictable and so I think the previous system of scoring 1 point for a winner and 3 for the correct amount of sets will work well, I do not think scoring that would be too difficult.
If people should preferably do their own scoring as I suggested then the scoring really should be as simple as possible, you'd be surprised how easily people can get confused (no offence to anybody :p). It would just make it quicker and easier for people to do the scoring and that has the greater benefit of making it more likely for people to join in; a benefit which I think outweighs the gains in perhaps more interesting scoring systems.

4. I would say that a max 8 matches could be put on any single day OOP. The problem with letting people score whatever match they liked would mean that everyone would pick the obvious match to predict- for example for today they would pick Federer in 3 and tomorrow Djokovic in 3. This would lose the difficulty and interest in trying to predict 50/50 match-ups. I think allowing people to predict matches up to the start of each match is a good idea and so the OOP should always have a few later matches in it so people will still see a point in posting their picks.
To be honest people were somewhat picking the obvious scorelines before and using their banker on the most obvious results. There is a a downside to doing this however in that you will not separate yourself from the crowd, if a player decides to pick a less obvious match or scoreline it can work to their favour by gaining points on everybody else if they then get it correct.

I personally think before the matches were getting a bit boring because the same people kept coming up at the start of tournaments, the middle average player match-ups which a lot of people were not really bothered much about.
[ Last edit by laundry May 28, 2015, 07:28 PM ] IP Logged
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