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New England Manager

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invisibleman18
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #15 on: April 27, 2006, 06:03 AM »
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Actually you are right, we have enough world class players to make a world class team, yet we are not a great team, just a team with great players. With some of the players we have, there is no excuse to not be one of the best teams. This is where the importance of the manager comes in.
A great manager is one who has the ability to transform great individuals into a great team IMO. Can Scolari be this man? I don't know, he has the credentials and the past achievements to suggest he can be. Sven clearly does not fit this description.
But surely when we beat Germany 5-1 in Munich, you thought that was a decent performance? That 2-2 draw with Greece was more Beckham who played brilliantly than the team tbh.
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arka
Re: New England Manager « Reply #16 on: April 27, 2006, 06:17 AM »
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See Alex, we need to play the way we did against Greece and Argentina and Germany to win. Sven is pretty good, but the problem is that he always wants his players to defend solitary goals, and that is not right. Our defense is capable enough and we dont need the midfield to back up.
By the way, can Cole play in the final?
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arka
Re: New England Manager « Reply #17 on: April 27, 2006, 06:22 AM »
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I will say this again, the only way we can win is if we have Rooney, Owen and Beckham in full form. Rooney has been very good, Beckham has been amazing for Real this season[I have seen every match of theirrs and he and Casillas have been the only two consistent performers this season]. We need Owen in form though.
But our greatest tool can be Ashley Cole. We need him to stop Ronaldinho or any other playmaker. I have no reservations in saying that Cole is the best around in this department.
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Bevc
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #18 on: April 27, 2006, 08:07 AM »
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Actually you are right, we have enough world class players to make a world class team, yet we are not a great team, just a team with great players. With some of the players we have, there is no excuse to not be one of the best teams. This is where the importance of the manager comes in.
A great manager is one who has the ability to transform great individuals into a great team IMO. Can Scolari be this man? I don't know, he has the credentials and the past achievements to suggest he can be. Sven clearly does not fit this description.
But surely when we beat Germany 5-1 in Munich, you thought that was a decent performance? That 2-2 draw with Greece was more Beckham who played brilliantly than the team tbh.

I was going to mention the 5-1 win over Germany but that was at the beginning of the qualifying for the World Cup in 2002 and didn't want to go back that far!  Okay, Becks did play brilliantly that day against Greece (was in Tenerife watching that match, so remember quite well) but sometimes it takes the brilliance of one or two players to get a hold of the game and take it to the other team - England haven't done that at all recently!  I've wanted the other team to thrash us so that Sven would be out on his *rse and the team would get a wake up call but no!  Even 'calamity' had been called back into service - Man City have had some decent results of late though. 

Just look at the Scottish football team and Scottish rugby team with new 'home-grown' manager/coach.
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Bevc
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #19 on: April 27, 2006, 09:12 AM »
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Just thought of something else - must get of my soapbox soon - so Scolari was the manager of two teams that beat England.  Was that because the teams he was coaching were playing brilliantly or because England were playing poor? 

Portugal didn't play that brilliantly during Euro 2004 and scr*ped through on penalties - always Englands downfall!

God, it's all coming back to me - when Becks missed the first penalty and blamed it on the pitch! 
[ Last edit by Bevc April 27, 2006, 09:25 AM ] IP Logged
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #20 on: April 27, 2006, 09:42 AM »
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Trouble is, there was no outstanding English candidate. And I'm a Bolton fan!

When it came to the crunch, they had to look elsewhere.
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #21 on: April 27, 2006, 10:43 AM »
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whatever works for england is fine with me...
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Bevc
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #22 on: April 27, 2006, 10:54 AM »
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Trouble is, there was no outstanding English candidate. And I'm a Bolton fan!

When it came to the crunch, they had to look elsewhere.

Ah yes, big Sam would have been nice, but there was a candidate who might have been available - Martin O'Neill  confused
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invisibleman18
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #23 on: April 27, 2006, 11:00 AM »
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O'Neill aint English though. So he would be no different to Scolari IMO. British he may be, but not English.
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Bevc
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #24 on: April 27, 2006, 11:08 AM »
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O'Neill aint English though. So he would be no different to Scolari IMO. British he may be, but not English.

I know - he's from Northern Ireland - but I think I have said somewhere that I'd go for a British manager but an Englishman would be better but felt that they should not drag a manager away from their club or else I'd have gone for big Sam too!

My ultimate manager would be Stuart Pearce - like you - but don't think he has the experience yet - as you have stated!  hug
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invisibleman18
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #25 on: April 27, 2006, 11:18 AM »
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See Alex, we need to play the way we did against Greece and Argentina and Germany to win. Sven is pretty good, but the problem is that he always wants his players to defend solitary goals, and that is not right. Our defense is capable enough and we dont need the midfield to back up.
By the way, can Cole play in the final?

That is exactly right.
Sven's tactics are "Score early, then sit back and cling onto 1-0 for dear life." I seem to remember a very similar discussion about this on here a little while back in another thread, but its worth going over again. You can't play like this in international football and expect any sort of success. Against teams with the attacking brilliance of the likes of Brazil or Portugal or France, eventually they will score if you let them come at you. Fair enough it took France 89 minutes and Portugal 70 or 80 odd mins or however much it was. But you just can't hold on for that long against such teams. I feel Mclaren, as Sven's assistant, would just give us more of the same as this if he were in charge. Allardyce would also be the same. He would "smack it up the pitch, cross it to Crouchy, score and then kick the opposition off the park." And besides (and no offence at all to the Bolton fans), he hasn't actually achieved anything of any note to suggest he is any good, other than keeping a team in the premiership (please correct me if I'm wrong on that one, I don't know about his pre-Bolton career). 
As for Cole, I have no idea. He is back in training and played 90 minutes for the reserves recently, apparently he is due back in a couple of weeks so he may have a chance. He is most likely leaving in the summer anyway (huge loss for us, but if his heart isn't here then good riddance) so Wenger may not see any reason to play him again this season.

@Bev, yeah fair enough Portugal didn't play us off the park, it was almost the other way round. We lost it, they didn't win it. But fact is, they did win, and they did make the final. Brazil in 02 on the other hand wiped us off the park as if we were schoolboys. As usual against a big team, we scored quite early, tried to cling on without even crossing half way and inevitably lost. FFS we played for the last 30 mins against 10 men and didn't even manage to force their keeper to touch the ball, let alone make a save!
Don't get me wrong, I am a huge partiot. Of course I want an English manager. I am a lifelong Arsenal fan, but am starting to become disillusioned with it all as I'm just fed up supporting a bunch of foreigners. I started following the club cos I was from North London and wanted to support my home club. It saddens me to say that I am no long supporting my "home" club, just a bunch of players who happen to be based there. Personally, I cry inside every time we put out a matchday squad with not one home grown player. I find it disgraceful tbh. Of course I wish there was an English manager good enough, but trouble is, I can't think of one that is up to the job, and apparently neither could the FA. When it comes down to it, I'd be happier if our talented squad were achieving what they are capable of doing,- that is being serious contenders in tournaments rather than being good quater final bets, regardless of who is in charge - than I would be if we had, say Allardyce purely due to his nationality and failed to get past the group stages. Yes I do want an English manager, but if none of them are any good, which IMO is the case at this moment in time, then why appoint them?

I am not even saying I want Scolari, simply that he is a much better manager than any of the English alternatives, none of which deserve to mentioned in the same breath as him. So from that point of view, he is the better option.

Phew, that is one long rant. My apologies.
[ Last edit by invisibleman18 April 27, 2006, 11:23 AM ] IP Logged
invisibleman18
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #26 on: April 27, 2006, 11:19 AM »
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My ultimate manager would be Stuart Pearce - like you - but don't think he has the experience yet - as you have stated!  hug

Yeah, he is going to develop into a top class manager IMO, and you can't question his desire or his commitment to England. Definitely a future England manager.
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Bevc
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #27 on: April 27, 2006, 11:35 AM »
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That was one hell of a rant!  And I know what FFS means now!  [-X  Wink

Do you think that there is the same problem with managers as there is with teams - bring in ones from abroad because they have the better results?  The thing is, the teams from abroad seem to have more dosh than the ones here!  Or the clubs here that have got the money, bring in the foreign players.

Why's he leaving where he is?  Why don't they want him more?  Why don't Brazil want him?  Why did he go in the first place?

Can see I've touched a nerve - love a good debate!  hug
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #28 on: April 27, 2006, 11:36 AM »
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I'm a Bolton fan, and have to say that Big Sam is the best of the English candidates. For starters, the long ball stuff is pure rubbish. We play no more long ball than any other team. That all started when we beat Newcastle playing that way cos it suited that game and Souness went mouthing off to the press about how we were just Route One merchants.

But, truth is, Allardyce is brilliant tactically. He changes his team and the way we play according to the opposition/state of the game. If you look at our results over the last three seasons (finishing 8th - 6th - possibly 6th again - notice the steady climb?), you'll see an amazing consistency, i.e. we tend to beat teams we should beat, draw against teams we should draw against, and lose very few, usually to the better clubs.

Throw in to the equation the total, absolute lack of cash - we have spent more than half-a-million on only one player in the last seven seasons - Diouf, rumoured to have cost £4m - and you get a fuller picture of the incredible job Big Sam's done.
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invisibleman18
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Re: New England Manager « Reply #29 on: April 27, 2006, 11:50 AM »
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Thats exactly right Bev. Thats the reason why there are no good English managers. Because clubs are only looking at foreigners with good records. The English ones don't get a chance to develop, much the same as the players. We just have to hope that Stuart Pearce, relatively young in manager terms, develops into a good manager, capable of taking England somewhere good in the future.

Same with the players, managers seem to only look to foreign talent. they would rather buy a 16/17 year old Spaniard, than try to develop their own player from home. Thats why there is a lack of English talent at the moment. We may have a few world class players in the national team, but there isn't much outside the regular internationals.
If, for example Paul Robinson, top class keeper gets injured, the only other one around is Calamity James. There are no left wingers, other than Joe Cole who is not really a left winger. Outside of Owen and Rooney, who will score goals? Ashley Cole is one of the best few left backs in the world, who is there if he doesn't get fit in time. Wayne Bridge? Not an international player by a long shot. We can fill a starting lineuo with world class players, but there isn't much to write home about outside of those few players. And that is primarily because the young English players are just not getting the opportunities.

Scolari isn't leaving Portugal as far as I know. On his interview on the news he said he was contracted to Portugal and was going to the World Cup with them. The FA are trying to prise him away, or poach him. Why did he leave Brazil? Most coaches only do 1, or 2 at the most tournaments with an international team. Which is why Sven should have gone after Euro 2004. 2 failures was enough. There is so much pressure in Brazil, people commit suicide if they don't win the WC etc. Once he had won it, there was nothing left to achieve with them, and the pressure of doing it again would just be too great. So I suppose he did all he wanted, then looked for a new adventure.

You didn't really touch a nerve, in fact I'm not even really disagreeing with you. Football is probably one of my more knowlegeable subjects, so I can probably post better on it than other stuff.

Bloody hell, another essay. And I don't usually use a lot of the text language, but FFS sounds much nicer than typing it out in full doesn't it?

[ Last edit by invisibleman18 April 27, 2006, 11:52 AM ] IP Logged
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