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Wimbledon R4 : Murray vs Gasquet
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Poll
Outcome?
Murray in 3
2 (6.9%)
Murray in 4
11 (37.9%)
Murray in 5
13 (44.8%)
Gasquet in 3
2 (6.9%)
Gasquet in 4
1 (3.4%)
Gasquet in 5
0 (0%)
Total Voters: 29
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Wimbledon R4 : Murray vs Gasquet
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Yamor
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Yamor
Re: Murray vs Gasquet
« on: July 01, 2008, 03:08 pm »
Quote
I agree with you that Murray played brilliantly in the last two sets. All i was disagreeing with was whether Murray played worse in the first two then Gasquet did in the last two. I never said Murray didn't played better in the last two then Gasquet in the first half. Although, I'm not sure how much of either one's good play can be put down to the other ones bad play, so it is still debatable, IMO.
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Clydey
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Clydey
Re: Murray vs Gasquet
« on: July 01, 2008, 03:09 pm »
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Quote from: measdale on July 01, 2008, 03:06 pm
Taking unforced errors, in the first set Andy hit 13 (awful) and Gasquet hit 3 (good). In the fifth set, Gasquet hit 13 (awful) but Andy still hit 9 (bad).
So I feel statistics don't entirely back up your point, let alone prove it ...
Andy will need to hit consistent winners off Rafa's serve, because I think he's going to lose the vast majority of rallies. And if he was playing the way he was in the last couple of sets, I don't think he's capable of that. Therefore I don't think
that
Andy can get a break.
I don't see the complete absence of logic in that, but possibly I've explained it better this time.
Yes, but Andy actually hit more winners. That proves how well he played. It came up with the stats during the match. He even ended up hitting more BACKHAND winners than Gasquet..
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measdale
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measdale
Re: Murray vs Gasquet
« on: July 01, 2008, 03:10 pm »
Quote
I'd agree with Yamor that the outcome of that match was mainly determined by how badly they played in spells, rather than how well they played in other spells.
Which I think is why the actual
points
went far more closely with unforced errors than with winners.
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Clydey
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Clydey
Re: Murray vs Gasquet
« on: July 01, 2008, 03:11 pm »
Quote
Quote from: measdale on July 01, 2008, 03:06 pm
Taking unforced errors, in the first set Andy hit 13 (awful) and Gasquet hit 3 (good). In the fifth set, Gasquet hit 13 (awful) but Andy still hit 9 (bad).
So I feel statistics don't entirely back up your point, let alone prove it ...
Andy will need to hit consistent winners off Rafa's serve, because I think he's going to lose the vast majority of rallies. And if he was playing the way he was in the last couple of sets, I don't think he's capable of that. Therefore I don't think
that
Andy can get a break.
I don't see the complete absence of logic in that, but possibly I've explained it better this time.
Well, there was a complete absence of logic. Murray hit more winners, yet you insist that Gasquet's best at the start was much better than Andy's in the last 2.
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Yamor
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Yamor
Re: Murray vs Gasquet
« on: July 01, 2008, 03:14 pm »
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One point to remember (and I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with anything here) is that winners and unforced errors can both be very misleading stats, since both can be hugely influenced by the other guys play. For example, if I'd play Murray, he'd be able to hit winner after winner, but that wouldn't mean anything. Also, Nadal can force a lot of players into unforced errors, so in such a case, the amount of unforced errors wolf not always mean the opponent played crap.
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Mark
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Mark
Re: Murray vs Gasquet
« on: July 01, 2008, 03:15 pm »
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Quote from: Yamor on July 01, 2008, 03:14 pm
One point to remember (and I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with anything here) is that winners and unforced errors can both be very misleading stats, since both can be hugely influenced by the other guys play. For example, if I'd play Murray, he'd be able to hit winner after winner, but that wouldn't mean anything. Also, Nadal can force a lot of players into unforced errors, so in such a case, the amount of unforced errors wolf not always mean the opponent played crap.
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Clydey
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Clydey
Re: Murray vs Gasquet
« on: July 01, 2008, 03:16 pm »
Quote
Quote from: Yamor on July 01, 2008, 03:14 pm
One point to remember (and I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with anything here) is that winners and unforced errors can both be very misleading stats, since both can be hugely influenced by the other guys play. For example, if I'd play Murray, he'd be able to hit winner after winner, but that wouldn't mean anything. Also, Nadal can force a lot of players into unforced errors, so in such a case, the amount of unforced errors wolf not always mean the opponent played crap.
Agreed. My point was directed at Measdale, though. And my only point was that you can't say that Murray only played half decent in the last 2 sets. He played some fantastic tennis and came up with some magical shots.
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Neil
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Neil
Re: Murray vs Gasquet
« on: July 01, 2008, 10:05 pm »
Quote
Quote from: Josh on July 01, 2008, 01:56 pm
I put it down to me buying the re-sale tickets with Gasquet serving for the match in the 3rd
Had court 1 tickets so saw Nadal, and the first two sets of Safin, then went to see how long the queue was. It was quite short, and I feared there would only be one game left, but probably the best fiver I've ever spent.
Sounds very similar to my tuesday last year were i had court 1 tickets and got centre re-sales. Awesome stuff. MW members have all the luck
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