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ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
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ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
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Iluvandy
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 06:51 pm »
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Right. One I remember well. Drop shot from Andy. Fed runs forward picks up and returns but the ball had double bounced and the umpire missed it. Andy looked at Fed obviously waiting for him to say " not up" but he didn't. Then someone took the decision to replay the point on the big screen, several times actually, and the crowd got involved shouting who knows what. Then Fed asked the umpire to tell them to stop showing it "as it was causing controversy" And they did.
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 06:53 pm »
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Quote from: Elly on July 17, 2017, 06:33 pm
Once again - and I'm not being a pain - but show me how Fed has cheated? I just can't get on board with this and just think it's nonsense!
I can't show you because I can't remember the exact matches or details. All I remember in my head is that I have seen Federer cheat. I know that, that doesn't sound too convincing but I know I saw it. I can barely remember a single word Federer has said in interviews either but I know the profile of him I have built up from seeing them.
The same goes for every player; I can barely remember any of their matches I have seen or their interviews but I have built up a profile of them in my head. For example I know that I have seen Troiki cheat before but I can't tell you when, where or how he did it.
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Elly
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 06:58 pm »
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Quote from: laundry on July 17, 2017, 06:53 pm
I can't show you because I can't remember the exact matches or details. All I remember in my head is that I have seen Federer cheat. I know that, that doesn't sound too convincing but I know I saw it. I can barely remember a single word Federer has said in interviews either but I know the profile of him I have built up from seeing them.
The same goes for every player; I can barely remember any of their matches I have seen or their interviews but I have built up a profile of them in my head. For example I know that I have seen Troiki cheat before but I can't tell you when, where or how he did it.
We all have subjective memories. I've no desire to contest you, but just have to say, if you can't show me evidence how Fed has cheated his way to 19 Slams, I'm not buying the fact that he's a cheat. I think people just can't stand his level of success - And that's a sad thing.
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Iluvandy
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 06:58 pm »
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Quote from: laundry on July 17, 2017, 06:53 pm
I can't show you because I can't remember the exact matches or details. All I remember in my head is that I have seen Federer cheat. I know that, that doesn't sound too convincing but I know I saw it. I can barely remember a single word Federer has said in interviews either but I know the profile of him I have built up from seeing them.
The same goes for every player; I can barely remember any of their matches I have seen or their interviews but I have built up a profile of them in my head. For example I know that I have seen Troiki cheat before but I can't tell you when, where or how he did it.
I can remember quite a few and they are not all Fed. Berdych at the US Open, Djoko saying he didn't know he had to wait till the ball came to his side of the net before he could hit it, both stick in my mind.
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Aileen
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 06:59 pm »
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Quote from: Elly on July 17, 2017, 06:58 pm
We all have subjective memories. I've no desire to contest you, but just have to say, if you can't show me evidence how Fed has cheated his way to 19 Slams, I'm not buying it.
Nobody's saying he's cheated his way to 19 Slams, but ILA has just pointed to a prime example of how he did cheat.
And if you want an example of how bad a loser he is, at the AO final in 2009 he was beaten by Rafa then instead of allowing Rafa to enjoy his victory, particularly as he was the first Spaniard for x number of years to do so, Fed hogged the limelight by blubbing like a bairn with self-pity, not just once, but he was given the chance to get himself together, then came back and did some more blubbing! And the look on Rafa's face said it all. So Andy cried when he lost to Fed in 2012 but at least he kept his misery to a minimum and would probably have preferred not have been interviewed anyway.
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Elly
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:02 pm »
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Quote from: Aileen on July 17, 2017, 06:59 pm
Nobody's saying he's cheated his way to 19 Slams, but ILA has just pointed to a prime example of how he did cheat.
And if you want an example of how bad a loser he is, at the AO final in 2009 he was beaten by Rafa then instead of allowing Rafa to enjoy his victory, particularly as he was the first Spaniard for x number of years to do so, Fed hogged the limelight by blubbing like a bairn with self-pity, not just once, but he was given the chance to get himself together, then came back and did some more blubbing! And the look on Rafa's face said it all. So Andy cried when he lost to Fed in 2012 but at least he kept his misery to a minimum and would probably have preferred not have been interviewed anyway.
As I said above, Aileen. I think a lot of people just can't stand his level of success, and that's their problem to deal with - not his.
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Iluvandy
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:07 pm »
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Quote from: Elly on July 17, 2017, 07:02 pm
As I said above, Aileen. I think a lot of people just can't stand his level of success, and that's their problem to deal with - not his.
His level of success neither enriches nor impoverishes my life so I have no problem with it and, I suspect, neither does he. The problem seems to be yours, Elly.
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Aileen
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:08 pm »
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Quote from: Elly on July 17, 2017, 07:02 pm
As I said above, Aileen. I think a lot of people just can't stand his level of success, and that's their problem to deal with - not his.
Elly I have every admiration for all his achievements and for his tennis, but at the same time I'm not blind as to some of the not very pleasant things that he's said or done.
[ Last edit by Aileen July 17, 2017, 07:13 pm ]
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althusser
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:09 pm »
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Quote from: Elly on July 17, 2017, 07:02 pm
As I said above, Aileen. I think a lot of people just can't stand his level of success, and that's their problem to deal with - not his.
If that were true then we should see comparable levels of criticism of Rafa. We don't.
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:11 pm »
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I have remembered one instance of seeing a Federer I have not liked, after Novak beat him at the USOpen SF:
This in my opinion this is Federer showing his real self. A very bad loser, dismissive that Novak could be better than him, instead calling him "lucky". Just the way he speaks and conducts himself you can see when the facade has gone. That is one of my issues with him because I can see that Roger has often been fake in interviews and when you can see that over the years you can pick up on the arrogant things he is really thinking by what he says and how he acts. Deep down he has had little respect for other players over the years.
That said I agree with others that Roger has certainly been better in more recent times. I think losing plenty may have put his ego in check, that or it has improved with age. But I can still not forget how he has been for the most part of his career.
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Elly
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:14 pm »
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Quote from: laundry on July 17, 2017, 07:11 pm
I have remembered one instance of seeing a Federer I have not liked, after Novak beat him at the USOpen SF:
This in my opinion this is Federer showing his real self. A very bad loser, dismissive that Novak could be better than him, instead calling him "lucky". Just the way he speaks and conducts himself you can see when the facade has gone. That is one of my issues with him because I can see that Roger has often been fake in interviews and when you can see that over the years you can pick up on the arrogant things he is really thinking by what he says and how he acts. Deep down he has had little respect for other players over the years.
That said I agree with others that Roger has certainly been better in more recent times. I think losing plenty may have put his ego in check, that or it has improved with age. But I can still not forget how he has been for the most part of his career.
So what are you going to do if you want to be a winner? Tell everyone you're a loser? I really think people are so duplicitous. They want Andy to be aggressive, but they want him to be a 'nice guy'. Not much wonder he's ****** up!
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:25 pm »
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Quote from: Elly on July 17, 2017, 07:14 pm
So what are you going to do if you want to be a winner? Tell everyone you're a loser? I really think people are so duplicitous. They want Andy to be aggressive, but they want him to be a 'nice guy'. Not much wonder he's ****** up!
When someone believes they're better than everyone else and everyone else is below them and when they lose that their opponent must have been lucky or there was some other reason they won. Instead of having the humility to HONESTLY say congratulations, that they played well and beat me fairly on the day.
That's not the personality trait of someone I am ever going to like, plain and simple and I will always want to see them get beaten.
You will never ever see Andy do a presser like that, or even say or think it behind closed doors. Because simply he has much class and is a decent person where it counts.
I don't really have anything else to say beyond that.
[ Last edit by laundry July 17, 2017, 07:28 pm ]
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Elly
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:26 pm »
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Quote from: Iluvandy on July 17, 2017, 07:07 pm
His level of success neither enriches nor impoverishes my life so I have no problem with it and, I suspect, neither does he. The problem seems to be yours, Elly.
Can you please stop making this personal?
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Iluvandy
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:28 pm »
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Quote from: Elly on July 17, 2017, 07:26 pm
Can you please stop making this personal?
No problem with that. Can you?
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Elly
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Re: ATP/WTA Tour - The Other Players
« on: July 17, 2017, 07:29 pm »
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Quote from: laundry on July 17, 2017, 07:25 pm
When someone believes they're better than everyone else and everyone else is below them and when they lose that their opponent must have been lucky or there was some other reason they won. Instead of having the humility to HONESTLY say congratulations, that they played well and beat me fairly on the day.
That's not the personality trait of someone I am ever going to like, plain and simple and I will always want to see them get beaten. I don't really have anything else to say beyond that.
I just think that it goes beyond that. I do hear what you're saying, but I just don't take the same view.
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